From gnu_andrew at member.fsf.org Wed Apr 1 15:10:50 2009 From: gnu_andrew at member.fsf.org (Andrew John Hughes) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2009 15:10:50 +0000 Subject: FOSDEM 2009 Recordings Message-ID: <17c6771e0904010810i510f9912ia248a81ee78b9d29@mail.gmail.com> 2009/3/25 Andrew John Hughes : > You can now find Deepak's talk on 'The IcedTea Plugin' here: > > http://www.archive.org/details/fosdem_2009_free_java_the_icedtea_plugin > > Blurb from Deepak (http://fosdem.org/2009/schedule/events/java_icedtea_plugin): > > 'This talk is about the IcedTea Java Web Browser Plugin. > > It will be mostly technical -- starting off with the need for the > plugin and it's history. It will then delve into the elements of > plugin design, and implementation details affecting speed, security > and reliability. > > Finally, it will also cover known limitations, and future plans to fix > those limitations.' > > It's available under the Creative Commons Attribution No-Derivative > license (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nd/2.0/uk/). ?Please > feel free to distribute copies under those terms. > > Thanks to Deepak Bhole for allowing this to be made available. > > If there are any issues with the publication of these talks, please > contact me ASAP. > > More to come in time and with appropriate permissions, > -- > Andrew :-) > > Free Java Software Engineer > Red Hat, Inc. (http://www.redhat.com) > > Support Free Java! > Contribute to GNU Classpath and the OpenJDK > http://www.gnu.org/software/classpath > http://openjdk.java.net > > PGP Key: 94EFD9D8 (http://subkeys.pgp.net) > Fingerprint: F8EF F1EA 401E 2E60 15FA ?7927 142C 2591 94EF D9D8 > Robert Schuster's talk on cross-compiling IcedTea is now available. You can find all the talks with links to the slides as well on http://fuseyism.com#movies. -- Andrew :-) Free Java Software Engineer Red Hat, Inc. (http://www.redhat.com) Support Free Java! Contribute to GNU Classpath and the OpenJDK http://www.gnu.org/software/classpath http://openjdk.java.net PGP Key: 94EFD9D8 (http://subkeys.pgp.net) Fingerprint: F8EF F1EA 401E 2E60 15FA 7927 142C 2591 94EF D9D8 From Xiomara.Jayasena at Sun.COM Fri Apr 3 01:28:10 2009 From: Xiomara.Jayasena at Sun.COM (Xiomara Jayasena) Date: Thu, 02 Apr 2009 18:28:10 -0700 Subject: JDK 7 build 53 is available at the openjdk.java.net website Message-ID: <49D5662A.3050002@sun.com> The OpenJDK source is available at: http://hg.openjdk.java.net/jdk7/jdk7 http://hg.openjdk.java.net/jdk7/jdk7/rev/c235f4a8559d The OpenJDK source binary plugs for the promoted JDK 7 build 53 are available under the openjdk http://openjdk.java.net website under Source Code (direct link to bundles: http://download.java.net/openjdk/jdk7) Summary of changes: http://download.java.net/jdk7/changes/jdk7-b53.html -Xiomara From Dalibor.Topic at Sun.COM Wed Apr 8 16:22:35 2009 From: Dalibor.Topic at Sun.COM (Dalibor Topic) Date: Wed, 08 Apr 2009 18:22:35 +0200 Subject: OpenJDK Forum: Core Libraries Round Table Message-ID: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> Hi core libraries developers, I'd like to carry on doing these, as the last one we did for contributing into OpenJDK 6 was fun and productive, so per Alan Bateman's suggestion, it's time again tomorrow, on Thursday, for the OpenJDK Forum Date/Time: Thursday Apr. 9th, 8 AM Pacific, 1600 GMT, 5 PM Germany Subject: Core libraries round table Call Host: Dalibor Topic Expected Participants: * members of discuss at openjdk and core-libs-dev at openjdk mailing lists interested in hearing what everyone else is working on in the core libraries area. Synopsis: The agenda would be just go around the table and get everyone to speak on what they are working on in the core libraries area in OpenJDK. We will then switch to open discussion mode to hear people's questions, concerns, and suggestions on the subject matter. The call will be recorded, and the recording will be made available after the call - in a free format, of course! Dial in numbers: Passcode: 5817876 Speed dial extension for developers inside Sun: x44414 Country Toll Numbers Freephone/Toll Free Number ARGENTINA 0800-777-0463 AUSTRALIA ADELAIDE: 61-8-8121-4868 1-800-249-288 AUSTRALIA BRISBANE: 61-7-3102-0970 1-800-249-288 AUSTRALIA CANBERRA: 61-2-6100-1970 1-800-249-288 AUSTRALIA MELBOURNE: 61-3-9010-7739 1-800-249-288 AUSTRALIA PERTH: 61-8-9467-5249 1-800-249-288 AUSTRALIA SYDNEY: 61-2-8205-8125 1-800-249-288 AUSTRIA 43-1-92-86-506 0800-005-029 BELGIUM 32-1-150-0314 0800-4-8680 BRAZIL 0800-7610674 CHILE 1230-020-2867 CHINA* 86-400-810-4766 10800-712-1433 10800-120-1433 COLOMBIA 01800-9-156430 CZECH REPUBLIC 420-2-25-98-56-54 800-700-173 DENMARK 45-7014-0280 8088-6132 ESTONIA 800-011-1089 FINLAND Land Line: 106-33-146 0-800-1-10100 FINLAND Mobile: 09-106-33-146 0-800-1-10100 FRANCE LYON: 33-4-26-69-12-81 080-563-9647 FRANCE MARSEILLE: 33-4-86-06-00-81 080-563-9647 FRANCE PARIS: 33-1-70-70-74-20 080-563-9647 GERMANY 49-69-2222-2566 0800-000-3441 GREECE 30-80-1-100-0683 00800-12-6973 HONG KONG 852-2286-5731 800-930-705 HUNGARY 06-800-18013 INDIA 000-800-852-1266 INDONESIA 001-803-011-3787 IRELAND 353-1-247-5253 1800-932-145 ISRAEL 1-80-9214916 ITALY 39-02-3600-3642 800-986-570 JAPAN OSAKA: 81-6-7739-4769 0034-800-400828 JAPAN TOKYO: 81-3-5539-5189 0034-800-400828 LATVIA 8000-3025 LUXEMBOURG 352-27-000-1360 MALAYSIA 1-800-80-2812 MEXICO 001-866-627-0574 NETHERLANDS 31-20-718-8533 0800-020-1392 NEW ZEALAND 64-9-970-4769 0800-449-823 NORWAY 47-21-59-00-59 800-15414 PANAMA 011-001-800-5072129 PERU 0800-53733 PHILIPPINES 63-2-858-3715 POLAND 00-800-1212021 PORTUGAL 8008-14061 RUSSIA 8-10-8002-9683011 SINGAPORE 65-6883-9228 800-120-4662 SLOVAK REPUBLIC 421-2-322-422-21 SOUTH AFRICA 080-09-80416 SOUTH KOREA 82-2-6744-1081 00798-14800-6860 SPAIN 34-91-414-62-98 800-099-810 SWEDEN 46-8-505-78-524 0200-890-106 SWITZERLAND 41-44-580-4389 0800-001-523 TAIWAN 886-2-2795-7377 00801-137-766 THAILAND 001-800-1206-65656 UNITED KINGDOM BIRMINGHAM: 44-121-210-9021 0808-238-6025 UNITED KINGDOM GLASGOW: 44-141-202-3221 0808-238-6025 UNITED KINGDOM LEEDS: 44-113-301-2121 0808-238-6025 UNITED KINGDOM LONDON: 44-20-7075-3246 0808-238-6025 UNITED KINGDOM MANCHESTER: 44-161-601-1421 0808-238-6025 URUGUAY 000-413-598-3415 USA 1-203-418-3122 866-692-3163 VENEZUELA 0800-1-00-3733 cheers, dalibor topic -- ******************************************************************* Dalibor Topic Tel: (+49 40) 23 646 738 Java F/OSS Ambassador AIM: robiladonaim Sun Microsystems GmbH Mobile: (+49 177) 2664 192 Nagelsweg 55 http://openjdk.java.net D-20097 Hamburg mailto:Dalibor.Topic at sun.com Sitz der Gesellschaft: Sonnenallee 1, D-85551 Kirchheim-Heimstetten Amtsgericht M?nchen: HRB 161028 Gesch?ftsf?hrer: Thomas Schr?der, Wolfgang Engels, Dr. Roland B?mer Vorsitzender des Aufsichtsrates: Martin H?ring From Dalibor.Topic at Sun.COM Thu Apr 9 14:05:33 2009 From: Dalibor.Topic at Sun.COM (Dalibor Topic) Date: Thu, 09 Apr 2009 16:05:33 +0200 Subject: Update: OpenJDK Forum: Core Libraries Round Table In-Reply-To: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> References: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> Message-ID: <49DE00AD.6070001@sun.com> Dalibor Topic wrote: > Hi core libraries developers, > > I'd like to carry on doing these, as the last one we did for > contributing into OpenJDK 6 was fun and productive, so per > Alan Bateman's suggestion, it's time again tomorrow, on > Thursday, for the > > OpenJDK Forum > > Date/Time: Thursday Apr. 9th, 8 AM Pacific, 1600 GMT, 5 PM Germany > > Subject: Core libraries round table Expected Participants: I hope that we'll also be able to have Michael McMahon, Chris Hegarty, Alan Bateman and Vincent Ryan join us for the call. Since conference calls may be a somewhat new experience to some of us, here are a couple ground rules: * Please identify yourself by name and location when speaking. At least in theory, we could have more then one Dalibor on the call, for example, and for those of us not familiar with each Dalibor's voice, having a way to pick them apart is useful. * Please address individuals by name when speaking. That helps keep the discussion flowing, without causing confusion who a particular question, remark or idea is addressed to. * Please speak clearly and avoid side conversations and background noise. We'll use the #openjdk IRC channel on irc.oftc.net for side conversations. If you are not familiar with IRC clients, you can run the corresponding web start application at http://openjdk.java.net/irc/ . * Keeping the noise down When you're not speaking, please mute your own line by pressing *6 on your telephone keypad. To unmute press *6 again. * On Sun campus in Dublin? Please join Alan Bateman in conference room "James Joyce" in building 03. * On Sun campus in Santa Clara? Please join Mark Reinhold in conference room "Firewall" in building 22. * On Sun campus in Hamburg? Please join Dalibor Topic in conference room "Dublin". See & hear you soon, dalibor topic -- ******************************************************************* Dalibor Topic Tel: (+49 40) 23 646 738 Java F/OSS Ambassador AIM: robiladonaim Sun Microsystems GmbH Mobile: (+49 177) 2664 192 Nagelsweg 55 http://openjdk.java.net D-20097 Hamburg mailto:Dalibor.Topic at sun.com Sitz der Gesellschaft: Sonnenallee 1, D-85551 Kirchheim-Heimstetten Amtsgericht M?nchen: HRB 161028 Gesch?ftsf?hrer: Thomas Schr?der, Wolfgang Engels, Dr. Roland B?mer Vorsitzender des Aufsichtsrates: Martin H?ring From Dalibor.Topic at Sun.COM Thu Apr 9 15:05:25 2009 From: Dalibor.Topic at Sun.COM (Dalibor Topic) Date: Thu, 09 Apr 2009 17:05:25 +0200 Subject: Update: OpenJDK Forum: Core Libraries Round Table In-Reply-To: <49DE00AD.6070001@sun.com> References: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> <49DE00AD.6070001@sun.com> Message-ID: <49DE0EB5.1010606@sun.com> Dalibor Topic wrote: > > Please join Mark Reinhold in conference room "Firewall" in building 22. In Mars Bars, actually. cheers, dalibor topic -- ******************************************************************* Dalibor Topic Tel: (+49 40) 23 646 738 Java F/OSS Ambassador AIM: robiladonaim Sun Microsystems GmbH Mobile: (+49 177) 2664 192 Nagelsweg 55 http://openjdk.java.net D-20097 Hamburg mailto:Dalibor.Topic at sun.com Sitz der Gesellschaft: Sonnenallee 1, D-85551 Kirchheim-Heimstetten Amtsgericht M?nchen: HRB 161028 Gesch?ftsf?hrer: Thomas Schr?der, Wolfgang Engels, Dr. Roland B?mer Vorsitzender des Aufsichtsrates: Martin H?ring From Dalibor.Topic at Sun.COM Thu Apr 9 16:58:35 2009 From: Dalibor.Topic at Sun.COM (Dalibor Topic) Date: Thu, 09 Apr 2009 18:58:35 +0200 Subject: OpenJDK Forum: Core Libraries Round Table In-Reply-To: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> References: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> Message-ID: <49DE293B.50401@sun.com> Dalibor Topic wrote: > Hi core libraries developers, > > I'd like to carry on doing these, as the last one we did for > contributing into OpenJDK 6 was fun and productive, so per > Alan Bateman's suggestion, it's time again tomorrow, on > Thursday, for the > > OpenJDK Forum > > Date/Time: Thursday Apr. 9th, 8 AM Pacific, 1600 GMT, 5 PM Germany > > Subject: Core libraries round table A recording of the call is available on http://mediacast.sun.com/users/robilad/media/openjdk6-core-libs.ogg cheers, dalibor topic -- ******************************************************************* Dalibor Topic Tel: (+49 40) 23 646 738 Java F/OSS Ambassador AIM: robiladonaim Sun Microsystems GmbH Mobile: (+49 177) 2664 192 Nagelsweg 55 http://openjdk.java.net D-20097 Hamburg mailto:Dalibor.Topic at sun.com Sitz der Gesellschaft: Sonnenallee 1, D-85551 Kirchheim-Heimstetten Amtsgericht M?nchen: HRB 161028 Gesch?ftsf?hrer: Thomas Schr?der, Wolfgang Engels, Dr. Roland B?mer Vorsitzender des Aufsichtsrates: Martin H?ring From gnu_andrew at member.fsf.org Thu Apr 9 17:18:49 2009 From: gnu_andrew at member.fsf.org (Andrew John Hughes) Date: Thu, 9 Apr 2009 18:18:49 +0100 Subject: OpenJDK Forum: Core Libraries Round Table In-Reply-To: <49DE293B.50401@sun.com> References: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> <49DE293B.50401@sun.com> Message-ID: <17c6771e0904091018s1445c03eycfad3634fa45e66b@mail.gmail.com> 2009/4/9 Dalibor Topic : > Dalibor Topic wrote: >> Hi core libraries developers, >> >> I'd like to carry on doing these, as the last one we did for >> contributing into OpenJDK 6 was fun and productive, so per >> Alan Bateman's suggestion, it's time again tomorrow, on >> Thursday, for the >> >> ? ? ? OpenJDK Forum >> >> Date/Time: Thursday Apr. 9th, 8 AM Pacific, 1600 GMT, 5 PM Germany >> >> Subject: Core libraries round table > > A recording of the call is available on > http://mediacast.sun.com/users/robilad/media/openjdk6-core-libs.ogg > > cheers, > dalibor topic > -- > ******************************************************************* > Dalibor Topic ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Tel: (+49 40) 23 646 738 > Java F/OSS Ambassador ? ? ? ? ? AIM: robiladonaim > Sun Microsystems GmbH ? ? ? ? ? Mobile: (+49 177) 2664 192 > Nagelsweg 55 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?http://openjdk.java.net > D-20097 Hamburg ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? mailto:Dalibor.Topic at sun.com > Sitz der Gesellschaft: Sonnenallee 1, D-85551 Kirchheim-Heimstetten > Amtsgericht M?nchen: HRB 161028 > Gesch?ftsf?hrer: Thomas Schr?der, Wolfgang Engels, Dr. Roland B?mer > Vorsitzender des Aufsichtsrates: Martin H?ring > > > Thanks Alan and Dalibor for organising a great conference call. I picked up a lot of stuff I didn't even realise was happening for JDK7, like Josh's work on the new sorting algorithm which I'll be really happy to see go in. It's just a pity we don't see more of this on the mailing lists!!! Looking forward to the next one, -- Andrew :-) Free Java Software Engineer Red Hat, Inc. (http://www.redhat.com) Support Free Java! Contribute to GNU Classpath and the OpenJDK http://www.gnu.org/software/classpath http://openjdk.java.net PGP Key: 94EFD9D8 (http://subkeys.pgp.net) Fingerprint: F8EF F1EA 401E 2E60 15FA 7927 142C 2591 94EF D9D8 From Dalibor.Topic at Sun.COM Thu Apr 9 17:35:25 2009 From: Dalibor.Topic at Sun.COM (Dalibor Topic) Date: Thu, 09 Apr 2009 19:35:25 +0200 Subject: OpenJDK Forum: Core Libraries Round Table In-Reply-To: <17c6771e0904091018s1445c03eycfad3634fa45e66b@mail.gmail.com> References: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> <49DE293B.50401@sun.com> <17c6771e0904091018s1445c03eycfad3634fa45e66b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49DE31DD.3010002@sun.com> Andrew John Hughes wrote: > Thanks Alan and Dalibor for organising a great conference call. I > picked up a lot of stuff I didn't even realise was happening for JDK7, > like Josh's work on the new sorting algorithm which I'll be really > happy to see go in. It's just a pity we don't see more of this on the > mailing lists!!! I first learned of Josh hacking on tim sort through twitter, thanks to the jython crew: http://twitter.com/fwierzbicki/status/1402775078 > Looking forward to the next one, I'll be at traveling to the JAX conference two weeks from now, so the week of April 27th or May 3rd would work best for me. So let's think about doing another one three, four weeks from now. Does that sound OK? cheers, dalibor topic -- ******************************************************************* Dalibor Topic Tel: (+49 40) 23 646 738 Java F/OSS Ambassador AIM: robiladonaim Sun Microsystems GmbH Mobile: (+49 177) 2664 192 Nagelsweg 55 http://openjdk.java.net D-20097 Hamburg mailto:Dalibor.Topic at sun.com Sitz der Gesellschaft: Sonnenallee 1, D-85551 Kirchheim-Heimstetten Amtsgericht M?nchen: HRB 161028 Gesch?ftsf?hrer: Thomas Schr?der, Wolfgang Engels, Dr. Roland B?mer Vorsitzender des Aufsichtsrates: Martin H?ring From gnu_andrew at member.fsf.org Thu Apr 9 18:02:32 2009 From: gnu_andrew at member.fsf.org (Andrew John Hughes) Date: Thu, 9 Apr 2009 19:02:32 +0100 Subject: OpenJDK Forum: Core Libraries Round Table In-Reply-To: <49DE3449.5090002@sun.com> References: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> <49DE293B.50401@sun.com> <49DE3449.5090002@sun.com> Message-ID: <17c6771e0904091102p5cc3a062r90fa7083fd51877@mail.gmail.com> 2009/4/9 Tom Hawtin : > Dalibor Topic wrote: >> >> A recording of the call is available on >> http://mediacast.sun.com/users/robilad/media/openjdk6-core-libs.ogg > > Any chance of getting that in a mainstream format? Windows doesn't > understand it. Rhythmbox under VirtualBox freezes. > > Tom Hawtin > That is mainstream and Free: http://www.fsf.org/resources/formats/playogg -- Andrew :-) Free Java Software Engineer Red Hat, Inc. (http://www.redhat.com) Support Free Java! Contribute to GNU Classpath and the OpenJDK http://www.gnu.org/software/classpath http://openjdk.java.net PGP Key: 94EFD9D8 (http://subkeys.pgp.net) Fingerprint: F8EF F1EA 401E 2E60 15FA 7927 142C 2591 94EF D9D8 From Thomas.Hawtin at Sun.COM Thu Apr 9 17:45:45 2009 From: Thomas.Hawtin at Sun.COM (Tom Hawtin) Date: Thu, 09 Apr 2009 18:45:45 +0100 Subject: OpenJDK Forum: Core Libraries Round Table In-Reply-To: <49DE293B.50401@sun.com> References: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> <49DE293B.50401@sun.com> Message-ID: <49DE3449.5090002@sun.com> Dalibor Topic wrote: > > A recording of the call is available on > http://mediacast.sun.com/users/robilad/media/openjdk6-core-libs.ogg Any chance of getting that in a mainstream format? Windows doesn't understand it. Rhythmbox under VirtualBox freezes. Tom Hawtin From Dalibor.Topic at Sun.COM Thu Apr 9 18:09:40 2009 From: Dalibor.Topic at Sun.COM (Dalibor Topic) Date: Thu, 09 Apr 2009 20:09:40 +0200 Subject: OpenJDK Forum: Core Libraries Round Table In-Reply-To: <49DE3449.5090002@sun.com> References: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> <49DE293B.50401@sun.com> <49DE3449.5090002@sun.com> Message-ID: <49DE39E4.4070609@sun.com> Tom Hawtin wrote: > Dalibor Topic wrote: >> >> A recording of the call is available on >> http://mediacast.sun.com/users/robilad/media/openjdk6-core-libs.ogg > > Any chance of getting that in a mainstream format? Windows doesn't > understand it. Rhythmbox under VirtualBox freezes. I'll generate an mp3 in a few minutes, once I've figured out how to do it. Audacity has this great 'export to Ogg Vorbis' feature that just works. ;) cheers, dalibor topic -- ******************************************************************* Dalibor Topic Tel: (+49 40) 23 646 738 Java F/OSS Ambassador AIM: robiladonaim Sun Microsystems GmbH Mobile: (+49 177) 2664 192 Nagelsweg 55 http://openjdk.java.net D-20097 Hamburg mailto:Dalibor.Topic at sun.com Sitz der Gesellschaft: Sonnenallee 1, D-85551 Kirchheim-Heimstetten Amtsgericht M?nchen: HRB 161028 Gesch?ftsf?hrer: Thomas Schr?der, Wolfgang Engels, Dr. Roland B?mer Vorsitzender des Aufsichtsrates: Martin H?ring From Jeff.Dinkins at Sun.COM Thu Apr 9 18:22:00 2009 From: Jeff.Dinkins at Sun.COM (Jeff Dinkins) Date: Thu, 09 Apr 2009 13:22:00 -0500 Subject: OpenJDK Forum: Core Libraries Round Table In-Reply-To: <49DE39E4.4070609@sun.com> References: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> <49DE293B.50401@sun.com> <49DE3449.5090002@sun.com> <49DE39E4.4070609@sun.com> Message-ID: <9989FAA3-081F-460A-9E22-0BC8382AEC70@sun.com> VLC plays ogg. What? You don't have VLC? Well time to grab a copy! http://www.videolan.org/vlc jeff p.s. I vote to keep it ogg only to promote more people to use it :-) On Apr 9, 2009, at 1:09 PM, Dalibor Topic wrote: > Tom Hawtin wrote: >> Dalibor Topic wrote: >>> >>> A recording of the call is available on >>> http://mediacast.sun.com/users/robilad/media/openjdk6-core-libs.ogg >> >> Any chance of getting that in a mainstream format? Windows doesn't >> understand it. Rhythmbox under VirtualBox freezes. > > I'll generate an mp3 in a few minutes, once I've figured out how to > do it. > > Audacity has this great 'export to Ogg Vorbis' feature that just > works. ;) > > cheers, > dalibor topic > -- > ******************************************************************* > Dalibor Topic Tel: (+49 40) 23 646 738 > Java F/OSS Ambassador AIM: robiladonaim > Sun Microsystems GmbH Mobile: (+49 177) 2664 192 > Nagelsweg 55 http://openjdk.java.net > D-20097 Hamburg mailto:Dalibor.Topic at sun.com > Sitz der Gesellschaft: Sonnenallee 1, D-85551 Kirchheim-Heimstetten > Amtsgericht M?nchen: HRB 161028 > Gesch?ftsf?hrer: Thomas Schr?der, Wolfgang Engels, Dr. Roland B?mer > Vorsitzender des Aufsichtsrates: Martin H?ring > > From gnu_andrew at member.fsf.org Thu Apr 9 18:48:19 2009 From: gnu_andrew at member.fsf.org (Andrew John Hughes) Date: Thu, 9 Apr 2009 19:48:19 +0100 Subject: OpenJDK Forum: Core Libraries Round Table In-Reply-To: <9989FAA3-081F-460A-9E22-0BC8382AEC70@sun.com> References: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> <49DE293B.50401@sun.com> <49DE3449.5090002@sun.com> <49DE39E4.4070609@sun.com> <9989FAA3-081F-460A-9E22-0BC8382AEC70@sun.com> Message-ID: <17c6771e0904091148l6fa5747cu9c32eeca16467ec2@mail.gmail.com> 2009/4/9 Jeff Dinkins : > > VLC plays ogg. > > What? You don't have VLC? Well time to grab a copy! > > ?http://www.videolan.org/vlc > > jeff > > p.s. I vote to keep it ogg only to promote more people to use it :-) > +1 :) Personally, I think there was already a compromise by going with Ogg Vorbis over Speex ;) > > > On Apr 9, 2009, at 1:09 PM, Dalibor Topic wrote: > >> Tom Hawtin wrote: >>> >>> Dalibor Topic wrote: >>>> >>>> A recording of the call is available on >>>> http://mediacast.sun.com/users/robilad/media/openjdk6-core-libs.ogg >>> >>> Any chance of getting that in a mainstream format? Windows doesn't >>> understand it. Rhythmbox under VirtualBox freezes. >> >> I'll generate an mp3 in a few minutes, once I've figured out how to do it. >> >> Audacity has this great 'export to Ogg Vorbis' feature that just works. ;) >> >> cheers, >> dalibor topic >> -- >> ******************************************************************* >> Dalibor Topic ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Tel: (+49 40) 23 646 738 >> Java F/OSS Ambassador ? ? ? ? ? AIM: robiladonaim >> Sun Microsystems GmbH ? ? ? ? ? Mobile: (+49 177) 2664 192 >> Nagelsweg 55 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?http://openjdk.java.net >> D-20097 Hamburg ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? mailto:Dalibor.Topic at sun.com >> Sitz der Gesellschaft: Sonnenallee 1, D-85551 Kirchheim-Heimstetten >> Amtsgericht M?nchen: HRB 161028 >> Gesch?ftsf?hrer: Thomas Schr?der, Wolfgang Engels, Dr. Roland B?mer >> Vorsitzender des Aufsichtsrates: Martin H?ring >> >> > > -- Andrew :-) Free Java Software Engineer Red Hat, Inc. (http://www.redhat.com) Support Free Java! Contribute to GNU Classpath and the OpenJDK http://www.gnu.org/software/classpath http://openjdk.java.net PGP Key: 94EFD9D8 (http://subkeys.pgp.net) Fingerprint: F8EF F1EA 401E 2E60 15FA 7927 142C 2591 94EF D9D8 From mthornton at optrak.co.uk Thu Apr 9 19:06:27 2009 From: mthornton at optrak.co.uk (Mark Thornton) Date: Thu, 09 Apr 2009 20:06:27 +0100 Subject: OpenJDK Forum: Core Libraries Round Table In-Reply-To: <9989FAA3-081F-460A-9E22-0BC8382AEC70@sun.com> References: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> <49DE293B.50401@sun.com> <49DE3449.5090002@sun.com> <49DE39E4.4070609@sun.com> <9989FAA3-081F-460A-9E22-0BC8382AEC70@sun.com> Message-ID: <49DE4733.50902@optrak.co.uk> Jeff Dinkins wrote: > > VLC plays ogg. > > What? You don't have VLC? Well time to grab a copy! > > http://www.videolan.org/vlc > > jeff > > p.s. I vote to keep it ogg only to promote more people to use it :-) > Shouldn't you be using a format supported by Java ... ;-) Mark Thornton From gnu_andrew at member.fsf.org Thu Apr 9 19:22:58 2009 From: gnu_andrew at member.fsf.org (Andrew John Hughes) Date: Thu, 9 Apr 2009 20:22:58 +0100 Subject: OpenJDK Forum: Core Libraries Round Table In-Reply-To: <49DE4733.50902@optrak.co.uk> References: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> <49DE293B.50401@sun.com> <49DE3449.5090002@sun.com> <49DE39E4.4070609@sun.com> <9989FAA3-081F-460A-9E22-0BC8382AEC70@sun.com> <49DE4733.50902@optrak.co.uk> Message-ID: <17c6771e0904091222j1850a378r8ce209c314fd75e9@mail.gmail.com> 2009/4/9 Mark Thornton : > Jeff Dinkins wrote: >> >> VLC plays ogg. >> >> What? You don't have VLC? Well time to grab a copy! >> >> ?http://www.videolan.org/vlc >> >> jeff >> >> p.s. I vote to keep it ogg only to promote more people to use it :-) >> > Shouldn't you be using a format supported by Java ... > ;-) > > Mark Thornton > > Jogg/Jorbis: http://www.jcraft.com/jorbis/tutorial/Tutorial.html I don't think anyone wants to download this as a wav or au... ;) -- Andrew :-) Free Java Software Engineer Red Hat, Inc. (http://www.redhat.com) Support Free Java! Contribute to GNU Classpath and the OpenJDK http://www.gnu.org/software/classpath http://openjdk.java.net PGP Key: 94EFD9D8 (http://subkeys.pgp.net) Fingerprint: F8EF F1EA 401E 2E60 15FA 7927 142C 2591 94EF D9D8 From Dalibor.Topic at Sun.COM Thu Apr 9 22:05:53 2009 From: Dalibor.Topic at Sun.COM (Dalibor Topic) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2009 00:05:53 +0200 Subject: OpenJDK Forum: Core Libraries Round Table In-Reply-To: <49DE3449.5090002@sun.com> References: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> <49DE293B.50401@sun.com> <49DE3449.5090002@sun.com> Message-ID: <49DE7141.7040100@sun.com> Tom Hawtin wrote: > Dalibor Topic wrote: >> >> A recording of the call is available on >> http://mediacast.sun.com/users/robilad/media/openjdk6-core-libs.ogg > > Any chance of getting that in a mainstream format? Windows doesn't > understand it. Rhythmbox under VirtualBox freezes. http://mediacast.sun.com/users/robilad/media/openjdk-core-libraries-roundup.mp3 cheers, dalibor topic -- ******************************************************************* Dalibor Topic Tel: (+49 40) 23 646 738 Java F/OSS Ambassador AIM: robiladonaim Sun Microsystems GmbH Mobile: (+49 177) 2664 192 Nagelsweg 55 http://openjdk.java.net D-20097 Hamburg mailto:Dalibor.Topic at sun.com Sitz der Gesellschaft: Sonnenallee 1, D-85551 Kirchheim-Heimstetten Amtsgericht M?nchen: HRB 161028 Gesch?ftsf?hrer: Thomas Schr?der, Wolfgang Engels, Dr. Roland B?mer Vorsitzender des Aufsichtsrates: Martin H?ring From Xiomara.Jayasena at Sun.COM Fri Apr 10 04:31:22 2009 From: Xiomara.Jayasena at Sun.COM (Xiomara Jayasena) Date: Thu, 09 Apr 2009 21:31:22 -0700 Subject: JDK 7 build 54 is available at the openjdk.java.net website Message-ID: <49DECB9A.8010507@sun.com> The OpenJDK source is available at: http://hg.openjdk.java.net/jdk7/jdk7 http://hg.openjdk.java.net/jdk7/jdk7/rev/2ef382b1bbd5 The OpenJDK source binary plugs for the promoted JDK 7 build 54 are available under the openjdk http://openjdk.java.net website under Source Code (direct link to bundles: http://download.java.net/openjdk/jdk7) Summary of changes: http://download.java.net/jdk7/changes/jdk7-b54.html -Xiomara From Dalibor.Topic at Sun.COM Tue Apr 14 11:44:12 2009 From: Dalibor.Topic at Sun.COM (Dalibor Topic) Date: Tue, 14 Apr 2009 13:44:12 +0200 Subject: OpenJDK Forum: Core Libraries Round Table In-Reply-To: <108fcdeb0904101124r37d49da8jf36b6b4cfe56aa8d@mail.gmail.com> References: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> <49DE293B.50401@sun.com> <49DE3449.5090002@sun.com> <49DE7141.7040100@sun.com> <49DE836A.3020204@sun.com> <108fcdeb0904101124r37d49da8jf36b6b4cfe56aa8d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49E4770C.8020209@sun.com> Kevin Bourrillion wrote: > Curious if anyone is transcribing the call into text yet? Word-for-word > not necessary, but understandable? If no one says they've already done > that or at least started, I could volunteer. That would be great, Kevin - the list of speakers in order of first appearance is: Alan Bateman Chris Hegarty Vincent Ryan Michael McMahon Xueming (Sherman) Shen Ulf Ziebis Doug Lea Andrew Haley Josh Bloch Dalibor Topic Mark Reinhold cheers, dalibor topic > > > On Thu, Apr 9, 2009 at 4:23 PM, Tom Hawtin > wrote: > > Dalibor Topic wrote: > > Tom Hawtin wrote: > > Dalibor Topic wrote: > > A recording of the call is available on > http://mediacast.sun.com/users/robilad/media/openjdk6-core-libs.ogg > > Any chance of getting that in a mainstream format? Windows > doesn't > understand it. Rhythmbox under VirtualBox freezes. > > > http://mediacast.sun.com/users/robilad/media/openjdk-core-libraries-roundup.mp3 > > > Thanks for that, Dalibor. (I'm no fan of software patents, but it's > nice when things just work.) > > Tom > > > > > -- > Kevin Bourrillion @ Google > internal: http://go/javalibraries > google-collections.googlecode.com > google-guice.googlecode.com > -- ******************************************************************* Dalibor Topic Tel: (+49 40) 23 646 738 Java F/OSS Ambassador AIM: robiladonaim Sun Microsystems GmbH Mobile: (+49 177) 2664 192 Nagelsweg 55 http://openjdk.java.net D-20097 Hamburg mailto:Dalibor.Topic at sun.com Sitz der Gesellschaft: Sonnenallee 1, D-85551 Kirchheim-Heimstetten Amtsgericht M?nchen: HRB 161028 Gesch?ftsf?hrer: Thomas Schr?der, Wolfgang Engels, Dr. Roland B?mer Vorsitzender des Aufsichtsrates: Martin H?ring From Weijun.Wang at Sun.COM Tue Apr 14 11:52:37 2009 From: Weijun.Wang at Sun.COM (Max (Weijun) Wang) Date: Tue, 14 Apr 2009 19:52:37 +0800 Subject: OpenJDK Forum: Core Libraries Round Table In-Reply-To: <49E4770C.8020209@sun.com> References: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> <49DE293B.50401@sun.com> <49DE3449.5090002@sun.com> <49DE7141.7040100@sun.com> <49DE836A.3020204@sun.com> <108fcdeb0904101124r37d49da8jf36b6b4cfe56aa8d@mail.gmail.com> <49E4770C.8020209@sun.com> Message-ID: On Apr 14, 2009, at 7:44 PM, Dalibor Topic wrote: > Kevin Bourrillion wrote: >> Curious if anyone is transcribing the call into text yet? Word-for- >> word >> not necessary, but understandable? If no one says they've already >> done >> that or at least started, I could volunteer. > > That would be great, Kevin - the list of speakers in order of first > appearance is: > To ease your acquaintance with them, comments are added: > Alan Bateman: the NIO2 guy > Chris Hegarty: the SCTP guy > Vincent Ryan: the ECC guy > Michael McMahon: the HTTP server guy > Xueming (Sherman) Shen: the corelib guy (sorry I forget what he said > in the conf) > Ulf Ziebis: I don't know who this is. Sorry. > Doug Lea: the concurrency guy > Andrew Haley: the RedHat guy > Josh Bloch: the sort guy > Dalibor Topic: the ambassador > Mark Reinhold: the chief Hope this helps. Max > > cheers, > dalibor topic > >> >> >> On Thu, Apr 9, 2009 at 4:23 PM, Tom Hawtin > > wrote: >> >> Dalibor Topic wrote: >> >> Tom Hawtin wrote: >> >> Dalibor Topic wrote: >> >> A recording of the call is available on >> http://mediacast.sun.com/users/robilad/media/openjdk6-core-libs.ogg >> >> Any chance of getting that in a mainstream format? Windows >> doesn't >> understand it. Rhythmbox under VirtualBox freezes. >> >> >> http://mediacast.sun.com/users/robilad/media/openjdk-core-libraries-roundup.mp3 >> >> >> Thanks for that, Dalibor. (I'm no fan of software patents, but >> it's >> nice when things just work.) >> >> Tom >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Kevin Bourrillion @ Google >> internal: http://go/javalibraries >> google-collections.googlecode.com > > >> google-guice.googlecode.com >> > > > -- > ******************************************************************* > Dalibor Topic Tel: (+49 40) 23 646 738 > Java F/OSS Ambassador AIM: robiladonaim > Sun Microsystems GmbH Mobile: (+49 177) 2664 192 > Nagelsweg 55 http://openjdk.java.net > D-20097 Hamburg mailto:Dalibor.Topic at sun.com > Sitz der Gesellschaft: Sonnenallee 1, D-85551 Kirchheim-Heimstetten > Amtsgericht M?nchen: HRB 161028 > Gesch?ftsf?hrer: Thomas Schr?der, Wolfgang Engels, Dr. Roland B?mer > Vorsitzender des Aufsichtsrates: Martin H?ring > > From gnu_andrew at member.fsf.org Tue Apr 14 12:21:34 2009 From: gnu_andrew at member.fsf.org (Andrew John Hughes) Date: Tue, 14 Apr 2009 13:21:34 +0100 Subject: OpenJDK Forum: Core Libraries Round Table In-Reply-To: References: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> <49DE293B.50401@sun.com> <49DE3449.5090002@sun.com> <49DE7141.7040100@sun.com> <49DE836A.3020204@sun.com> <108fcdeb0904101124r37d49da8jf36b6b4cfe56aa8d@mail.gmail.com> <49E4770C.8020209@sun.com> Message-ID: <17c6771e0904140521t7b598327v1274e056c73283aa@mail.gmail.com> 2009/4/14 Max (Weijun) Wang : > > On Apr 14, 2009, at 7:44 PM, Dalibor Topic wrote: > >> Kevin Bourrillion wrote: >>> >>> Curious if anyone is transcribing the call into text yet? ?Word-for-word >>> not necessary, but understandable? ?If no one says they've already done >>> that or at least started, I could volunteer. >> >> That would be great, Kevin - the list of speakers in order of first >> appearance is: >> > > To ease your acquaintance with them, comments are added: > >> Alan Bateman: the NIO2 guy http://blogs.sun.com/alanb/ >> Chris Hegarty: the SCTP guy >> Vincent Ryan: the ECC guy >> Michael McMahon: the HTTP server guy http://blogs.sun.com/michaelmcm/ >> Xueming (Sherman) Shen: the corelib guy (sorry I forget what he said in >> the conf) >> Ulf Ziebis: I don't know who this is. Sorry. >> Doug Lea: the concurrency guy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doug_Lea >> Andrew Haley: the RedHat guy Red Hat http://www.advogato.org/person/aph/ >> Josh Bloch: the sort guy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joshua_Bloch >> Dalibor Topic: the ambassador I thought Dalibor opened the call... was that not recorded? >> Mark Reinhold: the chief http://blogs.sun.com/mr/ > > Hope this helps. > > Max > >> >> cheers, >> dalibor topic >> >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Apr 9, 2009 at 4:23 PM, Tom Hawtin >> > wrote: >>> >>> ? Dalibor Topic wrote: >>> >>> ? ? ? Tom Hawtin wrote: >>> >>> ? ? ? ? ? Dalibor Topic wrote: >>> >>> ? ? ? ? ? ? ? A recording of the call is available on >>> >>> http://mediacast.sun.com/users/robilad/media/openjdk6-core-libs.ogg >>> >>> ? ? ? ? ? Any chance of getting that in a mainstream format? Windows >>> ? ? ? ? ? doesn't >>> ? ? ? ? ? understand it. Rhythmbox under VirtualBox freezes. >>> >>> >>> >>> http://mediacast.sun.com/users/robilad/media/openjdk-core-libraries-roundup.mp3 >>> >>> >>> ? Thanks for that, Dalibor. (I'm no fan of software patents, but it's >>> ? nice when things just work.) >>> >>> ? Tom >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kevin Bourrillion @ Google >>> internal: ?http://go/javalibraries >>> google-collections.googlecode.com >>> >>> google-guice.googlecode.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> ******************************************************************* >> Dalibor Topic ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Tel: (+49 40) 23 646 738 >> Java F/OSS Ambassador ? ? ? ? ? AIM: robiladonaim >> Sun Microsystems GmbH ? ? ? ? ? Mobile: (+49 177) 2664 192 >> Nagelsweg 55 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?http://openjdk.java.net >> D-20097 Hamburg ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? mailto:Dalibor.Topic at sun.com >> Sitz der Gesellschaft: Sonnenallee 1, D-85551 Kirchheim-Heimstetten >> Amtsgericht M?nchen: HRB 161028 >> Gesch?ftsf?hrer: Thomas Schr?der, Wolfgang Engels, Dr. Roland B?mer >> Vorsitzender des Aufsichtsrates: Martin H?ring >> >> > > -- Andrew :-) Free Java Software Engineer Red Hat, Inc. (http://www.redhat.com) Support Free Java! Contribute to GNU Classpath and the OpenJDK http://www.gnu.org/software/classpath http://openjdk.java.net PGP Key: 94EFD9D8 (http://subkeys.pgp.net) Fingerprint: F8EF F1EA 401E 2E60 15FA 7927 142C 2591 94EF D9D8 From Dalibor.Topic at Sun.COM Tue Apr 14 12:44:26 2009 From: Dalibor.Topic at Sun.COM (Dalibor Topic) Date: Tue, 14 Apr 2009 14:44:26 +0200 Subject: OpenJDK Forum: Core Libraries Round Table In-Reply-To: <49E482C9.3050108@gmx.de> References: <49DCCF4B.20506@sun.com> <49DE293B.50401@sun.com> <49DE3449.5090002@sun.com> <49DE7141.7040100@sun.com> <49DE836A.3020204@sun.com> <108fcdeb0904101124r37d49da8jf36b6b4cfe56aa8d@mail.gmail.com> <49E4770C.8020209@sun.com> <49E482C9.3050108@gmx.de> Message-ID: <49E4852A.2020306@sun.com> Ulf Zibis wrote: > > > Am 14.04.2009 13:52, Max (Weijun) Wang schrieb: >> >> >> To ease your acquaintance with them, comments are added: >> >>> Alan Bateman: the NIO2 guy >>> Chris Hegarty: the SCTP guy >>> Vincent Ryan: the ECC guy >>> Michael McMahon: the HTTP server guy >>> Xueming (Sherman) Shen: the corelib guy (sorry I forget what he said >>> in the conf) >>> Ulf Ziebis: I don't know who this is. Sorry. > > Correction: > Ulf Zibis: the charset-enhanced guy > https://java-nio-charset-enhanced.dev.java.net/ > >>> Doug Lea: the concurrency guy >>> Andrew Haley: the RedHat guy >>> Josh Bloch: the sort guy >>> Dalibor Topic: the ambassador >>> Mark Reinhold: the chief >> > Thanks, everyone, I added most of the links to http://robilad.livejournal.com/46797.html , and I'll add a pointer to the minutes, once they are available. cheers, dalibor topic -- ******************************************************************* Dalibor Topic Tel: (+49 40) 23 646 738 Java F/OSS Ambassador AIM: robiladonaim Sun Microsystems GmbH Mobile: (+49 177) 2664 192 Nagelsweg 55 http://openjdk.java.net D-20097 Hamburg mailto:Dalibor.Topic at sun.com Sitz der Gesellschaft: Sonnenallee 1, D-85551 Kirchheim-Heimstetten Amtsgericht M?nchen: HRB 161028 Gesch?ftsf?hrer: Thomas Schr?der, Wolfgang Engels, Dr. Roland B?mer Vorsitzender des Aufsichtsrates: Martin H?ring From Xiomara.Jayasena at Sun.COM Fri Apr 17 01:38:00 2009 From: Xiomara.Jayasena at Sun.COM (Xiomara Jayasena) Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2009 18:38:00 -0700 Subject: JDK 7 build 55 is available at the openjdk.java.net website Message-ID: <49E7DD78.4080702@sun.com> The OpenJDK source is available at: http://hg.openjdk.java.net/jdk7/jdk7 http://hg.openjdk.java.net/jdk7/jdk7/rev/aea0ace7a1e4 The OpenJDK source binary plugs for the promoted JDK 7 build 55 are available under the openjdk http://openjdk.java.net website under Source Code (direct link to bundles: http://download.java.net/openjdk/jdk7) Summary of changes: http://download.java.net/jdk7/changes/jdk7-b55.html -Xiomara From gbenson at redhat.com Mon Apr 20 09:29:58 2009 From: gbenson at redhat.com (Gary Benson) Date: Mon, 20 Apr 2009 10:29:58 +0100 Subject: Review request mails Message-ID: <20090420092957.GB3186@redhat.com> Hi all, I'm on quite a few OpenJDK mailing lists, and every day I get a ton of messages in my inbox with subjects like this: Review request for 3141593 Review request for 1862824 Review request for 2718282 Can we change the format of these messages to be a bit more meaningful? Something like this: Review request: 6538311: cannot restore segment prot after reloc or this: [REVIEW] 6538311: cannot restore segment prot after reloc Cheers, Gary -- http://gbenson.net/ From volker.simonis at gmail.com Tue Apr 21 08:53:33 2009 From: volker.simonis at gmail.com (Volker Simonis) Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2009 10:53:33 +0200 Subject: When the Sun goes down - what happens to the OpenJDK? Message-ID: Now that the Sundown is getting closer, I would like to start a discussion about various formal and legal aspects of the OpenJDK project. In the past years, since Sun has open sourced its Java SE reference implementation under the GPL, formal, legal and organisational aspects have always been somehow "pushed aside" with the argument that establishing a running infrastructure and a vibrant community has precedence. This has manifested itself in various shortcomings in the legal and organisation status of the project: - the Interim Governance Board which was initially created on Tuesday, 8 May 2007 had the duty to create a OpenJDK constitution, organize elections for a permanent Governance Board and dissolve itself not later than the 7 of May 2008. - after one year, none of the objectives were achieved so the Interim Governance Board decided to take another year time. It will now be dissolved on 7 May 2009. - after some changes in the Interim Governance Board the GB decided to extend itself from 5 to 7 members, however since this decision, nothing has happend. - the last available minutes from a GB meeting are dated from the 10th of April 2008 - applying for the "OpenJDK Community TCK License" is still obscure: one has to sign the SCA in order to be eligible but nevertheless Sun still reserves one's rights to decide to whom the license is granted. These shortcomings have always been hidden by Sun's apparent will to act in a "fair" and "reasonable" way. The community has honoured this and has finally believed Sun to "not be evil" (although this is another company's slogan:) But if Sun will be taken over by another company (whoever this company may be), the question arises how this new company will act with respect to the OpenJDK project. Some of the questions are: - what about the signed "Sun Contributor Agreements" - will they still be valid (ICA, OCA, HPCA, ... :)? - getting an "OpenJDK Community TCK License" is already a complicated and nontransparent process where Sun reserve one's rights to finally decide to whom to grant such a license. How will this be handled in the future? - will there be a OpenJDK Community TCK License for forthcoming Java versions? - what will happen to the "Interim Governance Board" and the "OpenJDK constitution" after the 7th of May 2009? Probably nobody will be able to answer these questions now and exactly therefore I think that it is crucial for the future of the OpenJDK to base the project on a more solid ground. One of the most important aspects in my opinion is to somehow grant OpenJDK implementers a permanent and irrevocable right to use current AND future TCKs in order to certify their OpenJDK implementations as "Java compatible"! What are your opinions and concerns? Regards, Volker From aph at redhat.com Tue Apr 21 09:41:13 2009 From: aph at redhat.com (Andrew Haley) Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2009 10:41:13 +0100 Subject: When the Sun goes down - what happens to the OpenJDK? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49ED94B9.8050404@redhat.com> Volker Simonis wrote: > Probably nobody will be able to answer these questions now and exactly > therefore I think that it is crucial for the future of the OpenJDK to > base the project on a more solid ground. Indeed. It shows that more effort should have been made to do this, but people at Sun have been very busy and there have been layoffs. Even so, the work to fix the governance issue really should have been done. It's still not too late. > One of the most important aspects in my opinion is to somehow grant > OpenJDK implementers a permanent and irrevocable right to use current > AND future TCKs in order to certify their OpenJDK implementations as > "Java compatible"! A nice idea, but I doubt that'll happen. As we know, TCK access has always been Sun's most jealously guarded prize. Andrew. From neugens at limasoftware.net Tue Apr 21 10:23:06 2009 From: neugens at limasoftware.net (Mario Torre) Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2009 12:23:06 +0200 Subject: When the Sun goes down - what happens to the OpenJDK? In-Reply-To: <49ED94B9.8050404@redhat.com> References: <49ED94B9.8050404@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1240309386.22719.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> Il giorno mar, 21/04/2009 alle 10.41 +0100, Andrew Haley ha scritto: > A nice idea, but I doubt that'll happen. As we know, TCK access has > always been Sun's most jealously guarded prize. But now the risk of having to do everything from scratch, with an entity that could have different goals and objectives than Sun, is high. Oracle has some reputation of being unfriendly with the JCP even, so I share Volker's fears, controlling the TCK could make it worse. Also, I don't know how much experience Oracle has in handling big Free/Open Source Software projects, but apart from contribution to Apache and PHP I doubt they can be considered an "Open Source" company, like Sun is from basically the very beginning. Of course, this will be something that has to be managed by the same people that are working on that at Sun (and this is valid for every other Sun product like Solaris, NetBeans and so on). Maybe it's time to try to have some sort of real foundation to drive the JCP and OpenJDK, this could help with the TCK too. I would likely see Red Hat and some other Linux distributors like Canonical to jump into this. Some words from the oracles would be nice to have. Cheers, Mario From geir at pobox.com Tue Apr 21 11:33:11 2009 From: geir at pobox.com (Geir Magnusson Jr.) Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2009 07:33:11 -0400 Subject: When the Sun goes down - what happens to the OpenJDK? In-Reply-To: <1240309386.22719.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <49ED94B9.8050404@redhat.com> <1240309386.22719.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: On Apr 21, 2009, at 6:23 AM, Mario Torre wrote: > Il giorno mar, 21/04/2009 alle 10.41 +0100, Andrew Haley ha scritto: > >> A nice idea, but I doubt that'll happen. As we know, TCK access has >> always been Sun's most jealously guarded prize. > > But now the risk of having to do everything from scratch, with an > entity > that could have different goals and objectives than Sun, is high. > > Oracle has some reputation of being unfriendly with the JCP even, so I > share Volker's fears, controlling the TCK could make it worse. I'm not sure what you mean here about Oracle. (BTW, I think that Volker is *right on* in general) My experience with them on the JCP is that they've been very supportive of openness and implementors having the freedom (not 'Freedom') to do with their code as they see fit, a value that Sun provably doesn't share. I have no real understanding of what they'll think about using the GPL going forward - they may leverage the downstream restrictions placed on users the same way Sun has in order to preserve the licensing revenue, but maybe not. Either way, shouldn't affect this community that much. My guess is that they are going to stop the silly games with the TCKy have it. Oracle doesn't strike me as a company afraid of competing in a market. > > > Also, I don't know how much experience Oracle has in handling big > Free/Open Source Software projects, but apart from contribution to > Apache and PHP I doubt they can be considered an "Open Source" > company, > like Sun is from basically the very beginning. Of course, this will be > something that has to be managed by the same people that are working > on > that at Sun (and this is valid for every other Sun product like > Solaris, > NetBeans and so on). > I think you are correct here, but as you say, they can keep the same people from Sun and start building their own experience in this area. > Maybe it's time to try to have some sort of real foundation to drive > the > JCP and OpenJDK, this could help with the TCK too. I would likely see > Red Hat and some other Linux distributors like Canonical to jump into > this. While I agree that making both of those independent is a good idea, I don't want to link the two - JCP and OpenJDK - since I think that general ecosystem governance should be kept separate from the implementation of any spec, including the RI of one of the platform specs. geir From mark at klomp.org Tue Apr 21 11:58:40 2009 From: mark at klomp.org (Mark Wielaard) Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2009 13:58:40 +0200 Subject: When the Sun goes down - what happens to the OpenJDK? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1240315120.3212.28.camel@fedora.wildebeest.org> Hi Volker, Thanks for starting this debate. On Tue, 2009-04-21 at 10:53 +0200, Volker Simonis wrote: > Now that the Sundown is getting closer, I would like to start a > discussion about various formal and legal aspects of the OpenJDK > project. In the past years, since Sun has open sourced its Java SE > reference implementation under the GPL, formal, legal and > organisational aspects have always been somehow "pushed aside" with > the argument that establishing a running infrastructure and a vibrant > community has precedence. In general I do think that was a good choice given the limited resources. Rules without people don't make a healthy community. But you are right that it seems to have resulted in no progress on the formalistic governance setup, which is indeed a little disappointing. On the other hand we seem to have various publicly active people now around the OpenJDK code base, not just from Sun, but also from various different corporations and various individuals. > This has manifested itself in various shortcomings in the legal and > organisation status of the project: > [...] > - applying for the "OpenJDK Community TCK License" is still obscure: > one has to sign the SCA in order to be eligible but nevertheless Sun > still reserves one's rights to decide to whom the license is granted. And more importantly, the TCK itself is still proprietary software hidden behind an NDA which makes the community as a whole unable to cooperate publicly on the compatibility story. We have to rely on good Samaritans like Red Hat, which accept such NDAs and do testing behind closed doors without full community involvement. > - what about the signed "Sun Contributor Agreements" - will they still > be valid (ICA, OCA, HPCA, ... :)? According to the Sun FAQ there are no guarantees in the SCAs that in case of a takeover an acquiring party will honor any transferred rights: http://www.sun.com/software/opensource/contributor_agreement.jsp#r_5 Neither are there any guarantees that I can see in the OpenJCK agreement that it won't be terminated after a year. All the copyright, distribution and patent rights granted under the GPL by any party (re)distributing the code base once distributed don't terminate, except if you act in breach of its requirements for providing full source code of course. > Probably nobody will be able to answer these questions now and exactly > therefore I think that it is crucial for the future of the OpenJDK to > base the project on a more solid ground. One of the most important > aspects in my opinion is to somehow grant OpenJDK implementers a > permanent and irrevocable right to use current AND future TCKs in > order to certify their OpenJDK implementations as "Java compatible"! The OpenJCK license agreement doesn't grant you any trademark rights (and I believe Sun claims to have a trademark on the phrase "Java compatible"). As far as I know there is no public agreement granting such trademark rights. But besides naming I agree that we should make sure to get a some free compatibility kit. The problem here is the JCP which grants Sun[/Oracle] special rights with respect to the platform TCKs. Hopefully a JSR for Java7 isn't accepted without making sure that the platform TCK is also available as free software. Of course the TCK is just a small piece in the compatibility picture. In the end the jtreg suite, mauve and running real applications are probably more important to guard the compatibility promise. Cheers, Mark From geir at pobox.com Tue Apr 21 12:10:37 2009 From: geir at pobox.com (Geir Magnusson Jr.) Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2009 08:10:37 -0400 Subject: When the Sun goes down - what happens to the OpenJDK? In-Reply-To: <1240315120.3212.28.camel@fedora.wildebeest.org> References: <1240315120.3212.28.camel@fedora.wildebeest.org> Message-ID: <31E0D4A1-8588-44C7-B582-39BDE8855C64@pobox.com> On Apr 21, 2009, at 7:58 AM, Mark Wielaard wrote: > > >> Probably nobody will be able to answer these questions now and >> exactly >> therefore I think that it is crucial for the future of the OpenJDK to >> base the project on a more solid ground. One of the most important >> aspects in my opinion is to somehow grant OpenJDK implementers a >> permanent and irrevocable right to use current AND future TCKs in >> order to certify their OpenJDK implementations as "Java compatible"! > > The OpenJCK license agreement doesn't grant you any trademark rights > (and I believe Sun claims to have a trademark on the phrase "Java > compatible"). As far as I know there is no public agreement granting > such trademark rights. Sun has claimed all sorts of odd things over the years. They can't complain if you say that "this software is compatible with the Java specification" if it passes the TCK. The trick, of course, is getting the TCK :) > > > But besides naming I agree that we should make sure to get a some free > compatibility kit. The problem here is the JCP which grants Sun[/ > Oracle] > special rights with respect to the platform TCKs. Hopefully a JSR for > Java7 isn't accepted without making sure that the platform TCK is also > available as free software. I'm not sure what you mean. The JSPA grants Sun an effective veto regarding "platform JSRs" (EE, SE, ME), but they have no special rights wrt the platform TCKs. The platform TCKs are just TCKs, and the licensing of them must conform to the JSPA. (see "fight, Apache and Sun, Java SE TCK" for more information :) I'm all for TCKs being open source or "free" software, but I'm not convinced that it's necessary. I can live with non-free/non-open TCKs. geir From mark at klomp.org Tue Apr 21 12:59:55 2009 From: mark at klomp.org (Mark Wielaard) Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2009 14:59:55 +0200 Subject: When the Sun goes down - what happens to the OpenJDK? In-Reply-To: <31E0D4A1-8588-44C7-B582-39BDE8855C64@pobox.com> References: <1240315120.3212.28.camel@fedora.wildebeest.org> <31E0D4A1-8588-44C7-B582-39BDE8855C64@pobox.com> Message-ID: <1240318795.3212.68.camel@fedora.wildebeest.org> On Tue, 2009-04-21 at 08:10 -0400, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote: > > But besides naming I agree that we should make sure to get a some free > > compatibility kit. The problem here is the JCP which grants Sun[/ > > Oracle] > > special rights with respect to the platform TCKs. Hopefully a JSR for > > Java7 isn't accepted without making sure that the platform TCK is also > > available as free software. > > I'm not sure what you mean. The JSPA grants Sun an effective veto > regarding "platform JSRs" (EE, SE, ME), but they have no special > rights wrt the platform TCKs. The platform TCKs are just TCKs, and > the licensing of them must conform to the JSPA. (see "fight, Apache > and Sun, Java SE TCK" for more information :) It probably depends on how you interpret JSPA 5.F.IV. which seems to explicitly exclude Sun from all such legal obligations except for offering a TCK separately (but under its own terms) from any RI. But I agree that the JSPA is a twisted document that can be interpreted in multiple ways. At least to this reader it seems to grant a lot of privileges to Sun above and beyond any other participant. The current setup of the JCP at least seems not ideal for free software community participation. > I'm all for TCKs being open source or "free" software, but I'm not > convinced that it's necessary. I can live with non-free/non-open TCKs. We clearly differ on this point. I think it is necessary and that "compatibility through NDAs" is just nuts and hurts the community and users at large. Cheers, Mark From geir at pobox.com Tue Apr 21 13:11:32 2009 From: geir at pobox.com (Geir Magnusson Jr.) Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2009 09:11:32 -0400 Subject: When the Sun goes down - what happens to the OpenJDK? In-Reply-To: <1240318795.3212.68.camel@fedora.wildebeest.org> References: <1240315120.3212.28.camel@fedora.wildebeest.org> <31E0D4A1-8588-44C7-B582-39BDE8855C64@pobox.com> <1240318795.3212.68.camel@fedora.wildebeest.org> Message-ID: On Apr 21, 2009, at 8:59 AM, Mark Wielaard wrote: > On Tue, 2009-04-21 at 08:10 -0400, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote: >>> But besides naming I agree that we should make sure to get a some >>> free >>> compatibility kit. The problem here is the JCP which grants Sun[/ >>> Oracle] >>> special rights with respect to the platform TCKs. Hopefully a JSR >>> for >>> Java7 isn't accepted without making sure that the platform TCK is >>> also >>> available as free software. >> >> I'm not sure what you mean. The JSPA grants Sun an effective veto >> regarding "platform JSRs" (EE, SE, ME), but they have no special >> rights wrt the platform TCKs. The platform TCKs are just TCKs, and >> the licensing of them must conform to the JSPA. (see "fight, Apache >> and Sun, Java SE TCK" for more information :) > > It probably depends on how you interpret JSPA 5.F.IV. which seems to > explicitly exclude Sun from all such legal obligations except for > offering a TCK separately (but under its own terms) from any RI. Right - I don't know the history, but I assume that Sun wanted to protect it's existing agreements that didn't conform, and any subsequent renewals. It's hard to imagine that anyone involved with the exception of Sun's lawyers thought it should allow Sun to do whatever it wants forever. > But I > agree that the JSPA is a twisted document that can be interpreted in > multiple ways. At least to this reader it seems to grant a lot of > privileges to Sun above and beyond any other participant. The current > setup of the JCP at least seems not ideal for free software community > participation. We are 100% in agreement. The current model is awful - it's a "hub and spoke" network of 1-1 contracts between members and Sun, which prevents any party other than a court in California from having any standing or ability to mediate a dispute, as the ASF's battle for an unencumbered Java SE TCK license has shown. > > >> I'm all for TCKs being open source or "free" software, but I'm not >> convinced that it's necessary. I can live with non-free/non-open >> TCKs. > > We clearly differ on this point. I think it is necessary and that > "compatibility through NDAs" is just nuts and hurts the community and > users at large. I didn't say I like NDAs. They should and must be abolished. But I can certainly accept getting software that's non-free or non-open to use for testing, as long as it doesn't require an NDA nor encumber the tested work with terms or obligations for the user beyond the license that I choose to use for my own work. I'm a Mac OS X user that has an iPhone, remember? :) geir From mark at klomp.org Wed Apr 22 08:11:01 2009 From: mark at klomp.org (Mark Wielaard) Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2009 10:11:01 +0200 Subject: When the Sun goes down - what happens to the OpenJDK? In-Reply-To: References: <1240315120.3212.28.camel@fedora.wildebeest.org> <31E0D4A1-8588-44C7-B582-39BDE8855C64@pobox.com> <1240318795.3212.68.camel@fedora.wildebeest.org> Message-ID: <1240387861.2346.23.camel@fedora.wildebeest.org> On Tue, 2009-04-21 at 09:11 -0400, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote: > On Apr 21, 2009, at 8:59 AM, Mark Wielaard wrote: > > On Tue, 2009-04-21 at 08:10 -0400, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote: > >> > >> I'm not sure what you mean. The JSPA grants Sun an effective veto > >> regarding "platform JSRs" (EE, SE, ME), but they have no special > >> rights wrt the platform TCKs. The platform TCKs are just TCKs, and > >> the licensing of them must conform to the JSPA. (see "fight, Apache > >> and Sun, Java SE TCK" for more information :) > > > > It probably depends on how you interpret JSPA 5.F.IV. which seems to > > explicitly exclude Sun from all such legal obligations except for > > offering a TCK separately (but under its own terms) from any RI. > > It's hard to imagine that anyone involved with the exception of Sun's > lawyers thought it should allow Sun to do whatever it wants forever. Which is why you should always read contracts before accepting and signing them. And if clauses are unclear, or could be interpreted literally to say something like the above, even if you personally believe the other party is probably "well intended and doesn't really mean it that way", to get a clarification beforehand, not at the last moment when the relationship has already tuned sour. That isn't to say that I think Sun acted in a sleazy way. After GNU Classpath/gcj/kaffe & friends were never allowed to get the Java SE TCK, even after applying for the scholarship more than 4 years ago now [1], we formed Harmony. And I do very well remember the confidence we all had that the Sun/Apache relationship would finally make all this JCP/TCK nonsense easier to handle and that alternative free java implementations would finally be granted free TCK access for the platform implementations. And that we GNU/Apache/Sun and friends would all work together in harmony. We all know how that turned out. It was probably naive to think something would improve without drastic reform of the way the JCP is setup. You acted very brave trying to do that from the inside, but I think it is finally time to do it from the outside and make the code leading, now that most of the java eco-system has accepted Free Software as the base of the java platform. Lets run with the code and just make it happen without these JCP dark room deals between big (proprietary) corporate interests. Especially now that, through OpenJDK we have the core platform reference implementation in hand as Free Software. > I'm a Mac OS X user that has an iPhone, remember? :) Yes, you are probably used to accept one-sides, proprietary, unfair agreements then :) Cheers, Mark [1] By our mutual friend Dalibor of course: http://www.advogato.org/person/robilad/diary/64.html From Xiomara.Jayasena at Sun.COM Fri Apr 24 01:13:27 2009 From: Xiomara.Jayasena at Sun.COM (Xiomara.Jayasena at Sun.COM) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 2009 18:13:27 -0700 Subject: JDK 7 build 56 is available at the openjdk.java.net website Message-ID: <49F11237.7070707@Sun.COM> The OpenJDK source is available at: http://hg.openjdk.java.net/jdk7/jdk7 http://hg.openjdk.java.net/jdk7/jdk7/rev/ba12117a5e6c The OpenJDK source binary plugs for the promoted JDK 7 build 56 are available under the openjdk http://openjdk.java.net website under Source Code (direct link to bundles: http://download.java.net/openjdk/jdk7) Summary of changes: http://download.java.net/jdk7/changes/jdk7-b56.html -Xiomara From Bradford.Wetmore at Sun.COM Fri Apr 24 02:52:36 2009 From: Bradford.Wetmore at Sun.COM (Brad Wetmore) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 2009 19:52:36 -0700 Subject: Request for comments: New Bugzilla-based sponsoring process In-Reply-To: <18855.17991.812626.848111@sun.com> References: <49A73955.8050409@sun.com> <18855.17991.812626.848111@sun.com> Message-ID: <49F12974.6080801@sun.com> From a while ago. I don't think Mark/Dalibor gave an answer to this yet... > Second, we include bug numbers in changeset comments. Should we use > the Sun bug id, the mozilla bug id, both? For now, use the Sun Bug id. In Dalibor's final sponsor document, he said to create a Sun bug if one does not already exist, and link the Bugzilla bug to the sun bug. Once we start tracking all bugs in Bugzilla, not just contributions, we'll probably change that. Brad