From adam.farley at uk.ibm.com Wed May 8 13:35:57 2019 From: adam.farley at uk.ibm.com (Adam Farley8) Date: Wed, 8 May 2019 14:35:57 +0100 Subject: Question: Where are JEPs discussed? Message-ID: Hi All, Does anyone know the answer to this question, raised on jep-changes: "What's a good way to stay informed about new JEPs and changes to existing JEPs?" Since the jep-changes list is basically silent, and the platform-jep-discuss list is near-silent, what would people recommend as a medium for JEP discussion? Best Regards Adam Farley IBM Runtimes Unless stated otherwise above: IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number 741598. Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU From adam.farley at uk.ibm.com Wed May 8 13:37:56 2019 From: adam.farley at uk.ibm.com (Adam Farley8) Date: Wed, 8 May 2019 14:37:56 +0100 Subject: Question: Where are JEPs discussed? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: cc'ing Florian Best Regards Adam Farley IBM Runtimes Adam Farley8/UK/IBM wrote on 08/05/2019 14:35:59: > From: Adam Farley8/UK/IBM > To: discuss at openjdk.java.net > Date: 08/05/2019 14:35 > Subject: Question: Where are JEPs discussed? > > Hi All, > > Does anyone know the answer to this question, raised on jep-changes: > > "What's a good way to stay informed about new JEPs and changes to > existing JEPs?" > Since the jep-changes list is basically silent, and the platform- > jep-discuss list is near-silent, what would people recommend as a > medium for JEP discussion? > > Best Regards > > Adam Farley > IBM Runtimes > > Unless stated otherwise above: > IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with > number 741598. > Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU Unless stated otherwise above: IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number 741598. Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU From neugens.limasoftware at gmail.com Wed May 8 14:48:29 2019 From: neugens.limasoftware at gmail.com (Mario Torre) Date: Wed, 8 May 2019 16:48:29 +0200 Subject: Resigning as Project Lead and phasing out Caciocavallo and this mailing list Message-ID: Hello all! It has been a ver long journey and there are an insane amount of beautiful memories hidden in the lines of this project, but as with all things of life, it's time for me to move to different priorities, so I'm resigning as Project Lead for the Caciocavallo Project. I know Cacio is being used in a couple of context outside the project space, so in order to facilitate the eventual appointment of a new Lead, I will remain in charge as Project Lead until the 15th of May at the latest. If by that date no suitable candidate that is willing to continue on the project is found, the project mailing list will be archived - this as part of the efforts for https://bugs.openjdk.java.net/browse/JDK-8220662 - and, if necessary, I will ask to "dissolve" the project, and after that consider the resignation official. If you are willing to step in, please do so before the 15th! Cheers, Mario -- pgp key: http://subkeys.pgp.net/ PGP Key ID: 80F240CF Fingerprint: BA39 9666 94EC 8B73 27FA FC7C 4086 63E3 80F2 40CF Java Champion - Blog: http://neugens.wordpress.com - Twitter: @neugens Proud GNU Classpath developer: http://www.classpath.org/ OpenJDK: http://openjdk.java.net/projects/caciocavallo/ Please, support open standards: http://endsoftpatents.org/ From neugens.limasoftware at gmail.com Wed May 8 16:06:04 2019 From: neugens.limasoftware at gmail.com (Mario Torre) Date: Wed, 8 May 2019 18:06:04 +0200 Subject: Resigning as Project Lead and phasing out Caciocavallo and this mailing list In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Il giorno mer 8 mag 2019 alle ore 17:22 Emilian Bold ha scritto: > > I knew that if I wait long enough on the mailing list it will pay off :-) > > I always thought that Caciocavallo will allow me to run desktop apps in the web browser some day... I wonder if we are getting close to that? If somebody does the work, yes :) > Are there any chances of something from Cacio being merged into JDK proper? Up until 8, things where working fine, then we got to do other things, I don't remember even when it was the last time I built this thing. I think some care should be taken for the modules. I don't see Cacio being merged in the JDK anytime since somebody needs to actively maintain this code. > Also, what is a maintainer supposed to do nowadays? It should work on the project and make sure it evolves, something I've not been very good at doing apparently ;) However the new maintainer should have a verifiable history of contributions (either on Cacio or at least OpenJDK). Cheers, Mario -- pgp key: http://subkeys.pgp.net/ PGP Key ID: 80F240CF Fingerprint: BA39 9666 94EC 8B73 27FA FC7C 4086 63E3 80F2 40CF Java Champion - Blog: http://neugens.wordpress.com - Twitter: @neugens Proud GNU Classpath developer: http://www.classpath.org/ OpenJDK: http://openjdk.java.net/projects/caciocavallo/ Please, support open standards: http://endsoftpatents.org/ From alex.buckley at oracle.com Wed May 8 17:29:53 2019 From: alex.buckley at oracle.com (Alex Buckley) Date: Wed, 08 May 2019 10:29:53 -0700 Subject: Question: Where are JEPs discussed? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5CD31211.40501@oracle.com> On 5/8/2019 6:35 AM, Adam Farley8 wrote: > Does anyone know the answer to this question, raised on jep-changes: > > "What's a good way to stay informed about new JEPs and changes to existing > JEPs?" > > Since the jep-changes list is basically silent, and the > platform-jep-discuss list is near-silent, what would people recommend as a > medium for JEP discussion? Early on, JEPs were stored in the jep/jeps repository (the "JEP Archive"). Changeset notifications for that repository were sent to the jep-changes list. Nowadays, JEPs are stored in the JDK Bug System, so the original purpose of the list is gone. If there is now to be a question asked about whether the JDK Bug System can send notifications about new issues of type "JEP", that question is best asked in Project Skara. The platform-jep-discuss list served to host (i) announcements about new JEPs and (ii) early discussion of features proposed by new JEPs. I have two observations: - Under Oracle's stewardship, the template for the lifecycle of a JEP has evolved considerably, so the drafting of a new JEP is not very significant. It would be actively wrong for someone seeing the announcement of a draft JEP to infer anything at all about the feature's scope and schedule, because ... - ... The six-month release cadence of the JDK Project means that feature development happens at its own pace in either (a) other Projects such as Amber or Valhalla, or (b) a Group such as the HotSpot Group, the Serviceability Group, or the Core Libraries Group. A feature can enjoy early discussion, prototyping, and polishing on the list of a Project or a Group while a JEP is being drafted. If the feature prospers, then the OpenJDK Lead at Oracle may judge that the feature is a candidate for inclusion in the JDK Project; the candidacy will be announced on the Project or Group list (this is when the JEP gets a number). If the feature _really_ prospers, then the OpenJDK Lead may target the feature for inclusion in a specific release of the JDK Project; its state changes will then be announced on jdk-dev, though ongoing feature development obviously stays on the Project or Group list. It's plain that the rationale for platform-jep-discuss is gone. There is no direct replacement for it. In a nutshell, JEPs are announced and discussed on Project and Group lists, and if they prosper, they will be finalized on jdk-dev. Alex From alex.buckley at oracle.com Wed May 8 17:50:06 2019 From: alex.buckley at oracle.com (Alex Buckley) Date: Wed, 08 May 2019 10:50:06 -0700 Subject: Question: Where are JEPs discussed? In-Reply-To: <5CD31211.40501@oracle.com> References: <5CD31211.40501@oracle.com> Message-ID: <5CD316CE.6070106@oracle.com> On 5/8/2019 10:29 AM, Alex Buckley wrote: > If the feature _really_ prospers, then the OpenJDK Lead may target > the feature for inclusion in a specific release of the JDK Project; > its state changes will then be announced on jdk-dev, though ongoing > feature development obviously stays on the Project or Group list. While I was writing the above, there were two announcements on jdk-dev of JEPs having their state changed (both were targeted to JDK 13): http://mail.openjdk.java.net/pipermail/jdk-dev/2019-May/002821.html http://mail.openjdk.java.net/pipermail/jdk-dev/2019-May/002822.html Out of interest, I followed the second mail's link to JEP 351. The Description field of JEP 351 told me that the feature -- an enhancement to ZGC -- is discussed on `hotspot dash gc dash dev at openjdk dot java dot net`. I visited the archives of hotspot-gc-dev for April and May, and immediately saw mails discussing the feature. The commitment to transparency, both by the feature's engineers and the OpenJDK Lead, is incredible. Alex From jesper.wilhelmsson at oracle.com Wed May 8 23:55:04 2019 From: jesper.wilhelmsson at oracle.com (jesper.wilhelmsson at oracle.com) Date: Thu, 9 May 2019 01:55:04 +0200 Subject: Question: Where are JEPs discussed? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1D5A95DF-1EBA-4174-AA63-6A46F1EE6E70@oracle.com> Just to answer your question "What's a good way to stay informed about new JEPs and changes to existing JEPs?" I have a JBS filter that finds all JEPs that has changed in the last week. https://bugs.openjdk.java.net/issues/?filter=35418 It will show all changes, and obviously some changes are more interesting than others, but looking at it once a week isn't too much work. Usually there are 10-12 JEPs updated each week. Modify the query to suit your needs. /Jesper > On 8 May 2019, at 15:35, Adam Farley8 wrote: > > Hi All, > > Does anyone know the answer to this question, raised on jep-changes: > > "What's a good way to stay informed about new JEPs and changes to existing > JEPs?" > > Since the jep-changes list is basically silent, and the > platform-jep-discuss list is near-silent, what would people recommend as a > medium for JEP discussion? > > Best Regards > > Adam Farley > IBM Runtimes > > Unless stated otherwise above: > IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number > 741598. > Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU From aph at redhat.com Thu May 9 11:55:42 2019 From: aph at redhat.com (Andrew Haley) Date: Thu, 9 May 2019 12:55:42 +0100 Subject: Question: Where are JEPs discussed? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 5/8/19 2:37 PM, Adam Farley8 wrote: > Adam Farley8/UK/IBM wrote on 08/05/2019 14:35:59: > >> Does anyone know the answer to this question, raised on jep-changes: >> >> "What's a good way to stay informed about new JEPs and changes to >> existing JEPs?" I'm not sure there is a single place, really. There are OpenJDK projects, and occasionally one will turn into a JEP. JEPs are announced on the jdk-dev list. Detailed discussion is on the project list. -- Andrew Haley Java Platform Lead Engineer Red Hat UK Ltd. EAC8 43EB D3EF DB98 CC77 2FAD A5CD 6035 332F A671 From alex.buckley at oracle.com Thu May 9 16:40:35 2019 From: alex.buckley at oracle.com (Alex Buckley) Date: Thu, 09 May 2019 09:40:35 -0700 Subject: Question: Where are JEPs discussed? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5CD45803.7000609@oracle.com> On 5/9/2019 4:55 AM, Andrew Haley wrote: > On 5/8/19 2:37 PM, Adam Farley8 wrote: >> Adam Farley8/UK/IBM wrote on 08/05/2019 14:35:59: >> >>> Does anyone know the answer to this question, raised on jep-changes: >>> >>> "What's a good way to stay informed about new JEPs and changes to >>> existing JEPs?" > > I'm not sure there is a single place, really. There are OpenJDK > projects, and occasionally one will turn into a JEP. JEPs are > announced on the jdk-dev list. Detailed discussion is on the project > list. "JEPs are announced on the jdk-dev list." is misleading. There are announcements about JEPs on jdk-dev, sure, but the announcements are not about the creation of new JEPs [*]. The announcements are about the readiness of pre-existing candidate JEPs for a specific JDK release. I suppose that a candidate JEP which has been kicked around on a Project or Group list for years, and is now being announced on jdk-dev for targeting, might be considered "new" in the sense of "new to the JDK Project". But it's also easy to imagine that a JEP which has been kicked around on a Project or Group list for months is "new" when, on reaching candidate status, it receives a number -- after all, the announcement on the Project or Group list is the only one which actually labels a JEP as "new" (e.g. "New candidate JEP: 341: Default CDS Archives"). All in all, it's best to be clear about the stage a JEP is in -- draft, candidate, and targeted are the main ones -- so that people don't assume that JDK N will have feature X just because a JEP issue exists in JBS. Alex [*] Very occasionally, there genuinely is an announcement on jdk-dev about the creation of a new JEP (e.g. JEPs 335 and 336 in June 2018) because the JEP will interest many Projects and Groups. And, very occasionally, JEP owners advertise their draft JEPs on jdk-dev, because of the wide readership. But it's the exception, not the rule, to see JEPs mentioned on jdk-dev before they're ready to target a release. From behrangsa at gmail.com Mon May 13 13:38:15 2019 From: behrangsa at gmail.com (Behrang) Date: Mon, 13 May 2019 23:38:15 +1000 Subject: Java and Web Assembly Message-ID: Hi all, Are there any current plans to: 1. Compile Java applications into Web Assembly (.wasm), and 2. Seamless loading of .wasm files in a Java program? *1* will allow Java libraries to be used in Node apps and inside the browser and *2* will allow Java programs to use .wasm libraries (hence C, Rust, etc. libraries compiled to Web Assembly too). For 1, there's http://teavm.org/ but I was wondering if there are any plans to support both of these features officially in OpenJDK and what the community thinks about these features in general? -- Best regards, Behrang Saeedzadeh blog.behrang.org From adam.farley at uk.ibm.com Mon May 13 16:07:10 2019 From: adam.farley at uk.ibm.com (Adam Farley8) Date: Mon, 13 May 2019 17:07:10 +0100 Subject: Question: Where are JEPs discussed? In-Reply-To: <1D5A95DF-1EBA-4174-AA63-6A46F1EE6E70@oracle.com> References: <1D5A95DF-1EBA-4174-AA63-6A46F1EE6E70@oracle.com> Message-ID: Thanks Jesper :) Best Regards Adam Farley IBM Runtimes jesper.wilhelmsson at oracle.com wrote on 09/05/2019 00:55:04: > From: jesper.wilhelmsson at oracle.com > To: Adam Farley8 > Cc: discuss at openjdk.java.net > Date: 09/05/2019 00:55 > Subject: Re: Question: Where are JEPs discussed? > > Just to answer your question "What's a good way to stay informed > about new JEPs and changes to existing JEPs?" > > I have a JBS filter that finds all JEPs that has changed in the last week. > https://bugs.openjdk.java.net/issues/?filter=35418 > > It will show all changes, and obviously some changes are more > interesting than others, but looking at it once a week isn't too > much work. Usually there are 10-12 JEPs updated each week. > > Modify the query to suit your needs. > /Jesper > > On 8 May 2019, at 15:35, Adam Farley8 wrote: > > Hi All, > > Does anyone know the answer to this question, raised on jep-changes: > > "What's a good way to stay informed about new JEPs and changes to existing > JEPs?" > > Since the jep-changes list is basically silent, and the > platform-jep-discuss list is near-silent, what would people recommend as a > medium for JEP discussion? > > Best Regards > > Adam Farley > IBM Runtimes > > Unless stated otherwise above: > IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number > 741598. > Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU > [attachment "signature.asc" deleted by Adam Farley8/UK/IBM] Unless stated otherwise above: IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number 741598. Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU From adam.farley at uk.ibm.com Mon May 13 16:06:49 2019 From: adam.farley at uk.ibm.com (Adam Farley8) Date: Mon, 13 May 2019 17:06:49 +0100 Subject: Question: Where are JEPs discussed? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks Andrew :) Best Regards Adam Farley IBM Runtimes Andrew Haley wrote on 09/05/2019 12:55:42: > From: Andrew Haley > To: Adam Farley8 , discuss at openjdk.java.net > Date: 09/05/2019 12:55 > Subject: Re: Question: Where are JEPs discussed? > > On 5/8/19 2:37 PM, Adam Farley8 wrote: > > Adam Farley8/UK/IBM wrote on 08/05/2019 14:35:59: > > > >> Does anyone know the answer to this question, raised on jep-changes: > >> > >> "What's a good way to stay informed about new JEPs and changes to > >> existing JEPs?" > > I'm not sure there is a single place, really. There are OpenJDK > projects, and occasionally one will turn into a JEP. JEPs are > announced on the jdk-dev list. Detailed discussion is on the project > list. > > -- > Andrew Haley > Java Platform Lead Engineer > Red Hat UK Ltd. u=https-3A__www.redhat.com&d=DwICaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx- > siA1ZOg&r=P5m8KWUXJf- > CeVJc0hDGD9AQ2LkcXDC0PMV9ntVw5Ho&m=wvTUuLhgG0SoGJrJqmAbDe9huvIBlOMCRMbXw0gN_vE&s=-28lhfmnwKHZaDIs1fFRc4EpzaknAtla4fuMDOVeIMU&e= > > > EAC8 43EB D3EF DB98 CC77 2FAD A5CD 6035 332F A671 > Unless stated otherwise above: IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number 741598. Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU From fweimer at redhat.com Tue May 14 08:15:34 2019 From: fweimer at redhat.com (Florian Weimer) Date: Tue, 14 May 2019 10:15:34 +0200 Subject: Question: Where are JEPs discussed? In-Reply-To: <1D5A95DF-1EBA-4174-AA63-6A46F1EE6E70@oracle.com> (jesper wilhelmsson's message of "Thu, 9 May 2019 01:55:04 +0200") References: <1D5A95DF-1EBA-4174-AA63-6A46F1EE6E70@oracle.com> Message-ID: <87d0klbgex.fsf@oldenburg2.str.redhat.com> * jesper wilhelmsson: > Just to answer your question "What's a good way to stay informed about > new JEPs and changes to existing JEPs?" > > I have a JBS filter that finds all JEPs that has changed in the last > week. https://bugs.openjdk.java.net/issues/?filter=35418 > Interesting idea. With a query like this one: issuetype = JEP AND watcher != currentUser() on can see JEP issues one hasn't subscribed to yet. I'll try to see if it's possible to run this query as a daily subscription. Thanks, Florian From adam.farley at uk.ibm.com Thu May 16 09:30:45 2019 From: adam.farley at uk.ibm.com (Adam Farley8) Date: Thu, 16 May 2019 10:30:45 +0100 Subject: Question: Where are JEPs discussed? Message-ID: Thanks for your insight too Alex. :) Sorry for the delay. I didn't get emails for any of your replies, and had to read the archives. Best Regards Adam Farley IBM Runtimes On 5/9/2019 4:55 AM, Andrew Haley wrote: > > On 5/8/19 2:37 PM, Adam Farley8 wrote: > >> Adam Farley8/UK/IBM wrote on 08/05/2019 14:35:59: > >> > >>> Does anyone know the answer to this question, raised on jep-changes: > >>> > >>> "What's a good way to stay informed about new JEPs and changes to > >>> existing JEPs?" > > > > I'm not sure there is a single place, really. There are OpenJDK > > projects, and occasionally one will turn into a JEP. JEPs are > > announced on the jdk-dev list. Detailed discussion is on the project > > list. > > "JEPs are announced on the jdk-dev list." is misleading. There are > announcements about JEPs on jdk-dev, sure, but the announcements are not > about the creation of new JEPs [*]. The announcements are about the > readiness of pre-existing candidate JEPs for a specific JDK release. > > I suppose that a candidate JEP which has been kicked around on a Project > or Group list for years, and is now being announced on jdk-dev for > targeting, might be considered "new" in the sense of "new to the JDK > Project". But it's also easy to imagine that a JEP which has been kicked > around on a Project or Group list for months is "new" when, on reaching > candidate status, it receives a number -- after all, the announcement on > the Project or Group list is the only one which actually labels a JEP as > "new" (e.g. "New candidate JEP: 341: Default CDS Archives"). > > All in all, it's best to be clear about the stage a JEP is in -- draft, > candidate, and targeted are the main ones -- so that people don't assume > that JDK N will have feature X just because a JEP issue exists in JBS. > > Alex > > [*] Very occasionally, there genuinely is an announcement on jdk-dev > about the creation of a new JEP (e.g. JEPs 335 and 336 in June 2018) > because the JEP will interest many Projects and Groups. And, very > occasionally, JEP owners advertise their draft JEPs on jdk-dev, because > of the wide readership. But it's the exception, not the rule, to see > JEPs mentioned on jdk-dev before they're ready to target a release. Unless stated otherwise above: IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number 741598. Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU From alex.buckley at oracle.com Thu May 16 15:33:51 2019 From: alex.buckley at oracle.com (Alex Buckley) Date: Thu, 16 May 2019 08:33:51 -0700 Subject: Question: Where are JEPs discussed? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5CDD82DF.2030202@oracle.com> Thanks Adam, you're welcome. The science of JEPs is not terribly difficult, but it's not widely examined either, so it's good to discuss. Alex On 5/16/2019 2:30 AM, Adam Farley8 wrote: > Thanks for your insight too Alex. :) > > Sorry for the delay. I didn't get emails for any of your replies, and > had to read the archives. > > Best Regards > > Adam Farley > IBM Runtimes > > On 5/9/2019 4:55 AM, Andrew Haley wrote: >> > On 5/8/19 2:37 PM, Adam Farley8 wrote: >> >> Adam Farley8/UK/IBM wrote on 08/05/2019 14:35:59: >> >> >> >>> Does anyone know the answer to this question, raised on jep-changes: >> >>> >> >>> "What's a good way to stay informed about new JEPs and changes to >> >>> existing JEPs?" >> > >> > I'm not sure there is a single place, really. There are OpenJDK >> > projects, and occasionally one will turn into a JEP. JEPs are >> > announced on the jdk-dev list. Detailed discussion is on the project >> > list. >> >> "JEPs are announced on the jdk-dev list." is misleading. There are >> announcements about JEPs on jdk-dev, sure, but the announcements are not >> about the creation of new JEPs [*]. The announcements are about the >> readiness of pre-existing candidate JEPs for a specific JDK release. >> >> I suppose that a candidate JEP which has been kicked around on a Project >> or Group list for years, and is now being announced on jdk-dev for >> targeting, might be considered "new" in the sense of "new to the JDK >> Project". But it's also easy to imagine that a JEP which has been kicked >> around on a Project or Group list for months is "new" when, on reaching >> candidate status, it receives a number -- after all, the announcement on >> the Project or Group list is the only one which actually labels a JEP as >> "new" (e.g. "New candidate JEP: 341: Default CDS Archives"). >> >> All in all, it's best to be clear about the stage a JEP is in -- draft, >> candidate, and targeted are the main ones -- so that people don't assume >> that JDK N will have feature X just because a JEP issue exists in JBS. >> >> Alex >> >> [*] Very occasionally, there genuinely is an announcement on jdk-dev >> about the creation of a new JEP (e.g. JEPs 335 and 336 in June 2018) >> because the JEP will interest many Projects and Groups. And, very >> occasionally, JEP owners advertise their draft JEPs on jdk-dev, because >> of the wide readership. But it's the exception, not the rule, to see >> JEPs mentioned on jdk-dev before they're ready to target a release. > Unless stated otherwise above: > IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number > 741598. > Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU From adam.farley at uk.ibm.com Fri May 17 13:28:53 2019 From: adam.farley at uk.ibm.com (Adam Farley8) Date: Fri, 17 May 2019 14:28:53 +0100 Subject: JDK-8223962: Proposal to Archive Mailing Lists - Final Stage Message-ID: Hi All, A while back, we discussed an idea to make it easier for folks to find the right mailing list for them. Some said the right choice was to archive some lists, and some liked a better front end for the mailing lists. Seemed to me that the former would help the latter, so I pursued that first. The short form for the proposal can be found here: https://bugs.openjdk.java.net/browse/JDK-8223962 The issue also includes the people who I consulted beforehand, so nothing nefarious is happening here. :) The final stage for this involves submitting that list to ops, and asking for those to be archived in a single transaction. I intend to do this at EOD Tuesday the 21st of May, so do contact me with any concerns prior to this date. Thanks for your time. :) Best Regards Adam Farley IBM Runtimes P.S. As for the website upgrade, I've written up a draft for that, and I'll be starting a seperate email chain for it. As always, polite opinions are welcome. Unless stated otherwise above: IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number 741598. Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU From adam.farley at uk.ibm.com Fri May 17 13:38:18 2019 From: adam.farley at uk.ibm.com (Adam Farley8) Date: Fri, 17 May 2019 14:38:18 +0100 Subject: Discussion: Mailing List Website Upgrade Message-ID: Hey All, Archiving the quieter mailing lists is a good first step in making it easier for people, especially newcomers, to contact the community. However, the current list interface still shows the archived lists, the "change set" lists, etc, which adds difficulty. One solution is to add an "intermediate" web page, where mailman is queried (via REST, or even web page source parsing) and the results are filtered. Here's a draft overview for such a web page, to start the discussion. -------------- Title: Percolator Purpose: To reduce the super-list of 193 mailing lists to something smaller, and more accessible. Location: https://openjdk.java.net/percolator (accessible via the "Mailing lists" link in the left-menu on most OpenJDK pages) Initial Content: - A title and short description for the page. - A short list of generic, popular lists (e.g. discuss, build-dev, core-libs-dev, and hotspot-dev) - A list of filter toggles, enabled by default (list below). - A link to the "full list" of mailing lists ( https://mail.openjdk.java.net/mailman/listinfo) - The usual left-menu common to most OpenJDK pages. Filter Toggles (enabled by default): - Specialist Lists (Basically everything other than the core lists) - Archived Lists - Change Set Only Lists. - Project Lists Note: all are disabled by default, and filters can overlap. Tech Specs: - Framework written in html. - Dynamic content populated by php if possible, javascript if neccessary. - Data retrieved by mailman either via REST or web page parsing. -------------- Thoughts? Feelings? Best Regards Adam Farley IBM Runtimes P.S. The issue for the web page work can be found here: https://bugs.openjdk.java.net/browse/JDK-8224113 Unless stated otherwise above: IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number 741598. Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU From adam.farley at uk.ibm.com Fri May 17 14:29:46 2019 From: adam.farley at uk.ibm.com (Adam Farley8) Date: Fri, 17 May 2019 15:29:46 +0100 Subject: Discussion: Mailing List Website Upgrade In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Adding a "cold lists" filter concept to reflect some helpful advice I received earlier. Best Regards Adam Farley IBM Runtimes Adam Farley8/UK/IBM wrote on 17/05/2019 14:38:18: > From: Adam Farley8/UK/IBM > To: discuss at openjdk.java.net > Date: 17/05/2019 14:38 > Subject: Discussion: Mailing List Website Upgrade > > Hey All, > > Archiving the quieter mailing lists is a good first step in making > it easier for people, especially newcomers, to contact the community. > > However, the current list interface still shows the archived lists, > the "change set" lists, etc, which adds difficulty. > > One solution is to add an "intermediate" web page, where mailman is > queried (via REST, or even web page source parsing) and the results > are filtered. > > Here's a draft overview for such a web page, to start the discussion. > > -------------- > Title: Percolator > > Purpose: To reduce the super-list of 193 mailing lists to something > smaller, and more accessible. > > Location: https://openjdk.java.net/percolator (accessible via the > "Mailing lists" link in the left-menu on most OpenJDK pages) > > Initial Content: > - A title and short description for the page. > - A short list of generic, popular lists (e.g. discuss, build-dev, > core-libs-dev, and hotspot-dev) > - A list of filter toggles, enabled by default (list below). > - A link to the "full list" of mailing lists (https:// > mail.openjdk.java.net/mailman/listinfo) > - The usual left-menu common to most OpenJDK pages. > > Filter Toggles (enabled by default): > - Specialist Lists (Basically everything other than the core lists) > - Archived Lists > - Change Set Only Lists. > - Project Lists - Cold Lists (See below for description) > Note: all are disabled by default, and filters can overlap. > > Tech Specs: > - Framework written in html. > - Dynamic content populated by php if possible, javascript if neccessary. > - Data retrieved by mailman either via REST or web page parsing. > "Cold Lists" Filter Definition: Non-archived lists identified as "Cold"; a reversible status that does not prevent list posting, unlike the more permanent "Archive" status. One option could be to enable/disable "Cold" status automatically by passing a threshold of activity (to be determined). This status could be undone (or prevented) by list owners pushing a button, or sending a request to X. This filter needs to be reviewed more than the others, due to its potential for causing arguments. > -------------- > Thoughts? Feelings? > > Best Regards > > Adam Farley > IBM Runtimes > P.S. The issue for the web page work can be found here: https:// > bugs.openjdk.java.net/browse/JDK-8224113 > > Unless stated otherwise above: > IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with > number 741598. > Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU Unless stated otherwise above: IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number 741598. Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU From adam.farley at uk.ibm.com Fri May 17 15:48:35 2019 From: adam.farley at uk.ibm.com (Adam Farley8) Date: Fri, 17 May 2019 16:48:35 +0100 Subject: Discussion: Mailing List Website Upgrade In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Fixed email formatting. Best Regards Adam Farley IBM Runtimes Adam Farley8/UK/IBM wrote on 17/05/2019 14:38:18: > From: Adam Farley8/UK/IBM > To: discuss at openjdk.java.net > Date: 17/05/2019 14:38 > Subject: Discussion: Mailing List Website Upgrade > > Hey All, > > Archiving the quieter mailing lists is a good first step in making > it easier for people, especially newcomers, to contact the community. > > However, the current list interface still shows the archived lists, > the "change set" lists, etc, which adds difficulty. > > One solution is to add an "intermediate" web page, where mailman is > queried (via REST, or even web page source parsing) and the results > are filtered. > > Here's a draft overview for such a web page, to start the discussion. > > -------------- > Title: Percolator > > Purpose: To reduce the super-list of 193 mailing lists to something > smaller, and more accessible. > > Location: https://openjdk.java.net/percolator (accessible via the > "Mailing lists" link in the left-menu on most OpenJDK pages) > > Initial Content: > - A title and short description for the page. > - A short list of generic, popular lists (e.g. discuss, build-dev, > core-libs-dev, and hotspot-dev) > - A list of filter toggles, enabled by default (list below). > - A link to the "full list" of mailing lists (https:// > mail.openjdk.java.net/mailman/listinfo) > - The usual left-menu common to most OpenJDK pages. > > Filter Toggles (enabled by default, and can overlap): > - Specialist Lists (Basically everything other than the core lists) > - Archived Lists > - Change Set Only Lists. > - Project Lists > - Cold Lists (See below for description) > > Tech Specs: > - Framework written in html. > - Dynamic content populated by php if possible, or even javascript. > - Data retrieved by mailman either via REST or web page parsing. > > "Cold Lists" Filter Definition: > Non-archived lists identified as "Cold"; a reversible status that > does not prevent list posting, unlike the more permanent "Archive" > status. > > One option could be to enable/disable "Cold" status automatically > by passing a threshold of activity (to be determined). This status > could be undone (or prevented) by list owners pushing a button, or > sending a request to a group or list. > > This filter needs to be reviewed more than the others, due to its > potential for causing arguments. > > -------------- > > Thoughts? Feelings? > > Best Regards > > Adam Farley > IBM Runtimes > P.S. The issue for the web page work can be found here: > https://bugs.openjdk.java.net/browse/JDK-8224113 >