In defense of the Windows x86-32 Port

Sun Feb 26 23:37:23 UTC 2023

Replying to all this time:

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Hi Mark,

Thanks for your mail!   Whilst I agree there are some interesting use cases for supporting the Windows 32-bit port, the cost of that maintenance to update to the latest language and VM features is simply too high given the 'market share' of Windows 32-bit Java applications.  Aleksey's port will prove to be useful as well as interesting! However, it does highlight that the maintenance burden would then largely fall on him in the long-term which I do not think is fair on him or sustainable.

Although Windows 32-bit serves a segment of Micrsoft's customers very well, it is fair to say that we do not see user/customer evidence that Windows 32-bit is a future destination for modern Java workloads :-).

Cheers,

Martijn (He/Him)

NOTE: My working day may not be your working day! Please don’t feel obliged to read or reply to this e-mail outside of your normal working hours.

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From: jdk-dev <jdk-dev-retn at openjdk.org> on behalf of mark.yagnatinsky at barclays.com <mark.yagnatinsky at barclays.com>
Sent: Sunday, 26 February 2023 18:09
To: jdk-dev at openjdk.java.net <jdk-dev at openjdk.java.net>
Subject: [EXTERNAL] In defense of the Windows x86-32 Port

I saw this JEP draft today: https://openjdk.org/jeps/8303167<https://nam06.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fopenjdk.org%2Fjeps%2F8303167&data=05%7C01%7Cmartijn.verburg%40microsoft.com%7Ceaf33e73f92140c17d6608db17b7a776%7C72f988bf86f141af91ab2d7cd011db47%7C1%7C0%7C638129849859232363%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=osNgUrCxMOp%2BMtgv6SgcCt%2FWwsRJ71AIDB4nlZGVvj8%3D&reserved=0>.  It suggests deprecating the 32-bit Windows port of OpenJDK.

And even though it’s “just a draft” it does mention Java 21 (which is pretty soon), so I thought I might as well put in my “two cents” now instead of waiting to see whether or not this ends up going anywhere.

The draft is written as though the (primary?) purpose of the port is to support running Java on 32-bit versions of Windows.

Those are indeed very rare, and getting even rarer.  But I appreciate the 32-bit builds even though I haven’t run a 32-bit version of Windows in ages.

Unlike MacOS, it is possible (and effortless) to run 32-bit executables on 64-bit Windows.  There are at least 2 reasons to do so:

The obvious reason is that maybe someone has some native code they’re calling via JNI, and they don’t have a 64-bit version handy.

The other reason is perhaps less obvious, and perhaps I’m the only person in the world who considers this a “reason” at all, but it motivated me to write this email so here it is:

The restriction to 32-bits is pretty effective as a poor man’s substitute for a proper sandbox.

For example, the draft JEP talks about Project loom, a topic near and dear to me.  When I first heard of Project loom, I wanted to run two silly experiments.

The first experiment was to launch as many “platform” threads as I could, and thus get a feel for how much they “cost”.  The second experiment was to do the same for “virtual” threads.

I actually carried out the first experiment, on a 32-bit JVM.  I did not dare to try the same experiment on a 64-bit JVM.

The reason is that I knew that with a 32-bit JVM, I would run out of address space before anything bad happened.

But if I tried the same thing with a 64-bit JVM, then for all I know I might bring my poor laptop to its knees and might even be forced to restart.

I’ve been eagerly awaiting Alexey Shipilev’s 32-bit port (is anyone else besides him working on this?) ever since then so I could try the “loom” part of the experiment.

I’ll be a bit disappointed if it never appears.

Anyway, that’s my two cents; thanks if you read this far.

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