JavaFX for the Enterprise - Working Group

Thu Oct 18 10:54:31 PDT 2012

The AWT / Glass guys actually have a prototype of all of SwingSet running in JavaFX. I think most of the technical hurdles have been resolved (? Artem would know better), but it is just a matter of resourcing (there were some changes in AWT to get the best performance / integration).

Richard

On Oct 18, 2012, at 10:43 AM, Mario Torre wrote:

> Hi Richard,
> 
> You should probably look at this old mail, since this may be what you need.
> 
> http://mail.openjdk.java.net/pipermail/openjfx-dev/2011-December/000021.html
> 
> We need to port this code to 2.2, I'll try to give it some love this
> week, it should give us also some good performances.
> 
> Cheers,
> Mario
> 
> 2012/10/18 Richard Bair <richard.bair at oracle.com>:
>> From talking with the NB team, one feature they really need is to be able to embed Swing within JavaFX. Hopefully we can deliver on that for 8.
>> 
>> On Oct 17, 2012, at 7:40 AM, Mark Claassen wrote:
>> 
>>> I joined this list a few days ago because I wanted to start contributing
>>> So far, I am not sure it is quite where I should be.  I would like to
>>> discuss more about the components (table, list boxes, ...).  I am not
>>> exactly sure where to do that.
>>> 
>>> However, I will add here that I started (a very short-lived) thread on the
>>> netbeans user list along these lines.  Basically what I was saying was that
>>> Netbeans is a wonderful UI built on Swing.  Could this same project be done
>>> in JavaFX?  Maybe not yet, but could it be in the future?  It seems like
>>> the JavaFX team could get a lot of advice and requirements from the
>>> netbeans team.
>>> 
>>> http://forums.netbeans.org/topic51717.html
>>> 
>>> Some of the main data structures, like the ObservableList, make me cringe.
>>> I created a similar structure 10 years ago and have since learned the error
>>> of my ways.  Granted, the JavaFX team has a lot more resources and
>>> experience than I did all those years ago, but from my point of view, there
>>> are dangerous waters ahead.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Wed, Oct 17, 2012 at 10:23 AM, Richard Bair <richard.bair at oracle.com>wrote:
>>> 
>>>> We are already doing everything on your list (which was pretty void of
>>>> specifics). Please list specific work projects, linked to specific JIRA
>>>> issues, and vote for them and for goodness sake contribute!
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On Oct 17, 2012, at 12:49 AM, Daniel Zwolenski <zonski at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> So Oracle as an organization doesn't think JavaFX can be a player in the
>>>>> web/enterprise space and is backing HTML5. I don't agree, JavaFX has the
>>>> *
>>>>> potential* to be better. But it's a long way behind and gotten off to a
>>>>> rocky start; there's a hell of a lot of work to be done and the current
>>>>> rate, strategy and direction are not going to be nearly enough.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Oracle is a big corporation with many different divisions. The left arm
>>>>> doesn't know what the right is doing. So let's put aside 'oracle' for a
>>>>> moment. I want to know: what does the JavaFX team think? Do you want to
>>>> go
>>>>> up against HTML5 for the client space, or just settle for a spot on the
>>>>> fringe?
>>>>> 
>>>>> Below is what I propose.
>>>>> 
>>>>> This proposal needs the full backing of the JavaFX team and management.
>>>>> Specifically it needs:
>>>>> 
>>>>> 1. Belief that JavaFX can and should be the *number one* client
>>>>> development platform for enterprise.
>>>>> 2. Recognition that the current strategy will not make that happen.
>>>>> 3. Resources (aka people) allocated to the working group outlined
>>>> below.
>>>>> These people must have enough influence in the JFX platform to
>>>> legitimately
>>>>> be able to influence the direction as needed.
>>>>> 4. Commitment to supporting this working group fully and implementing
>>>>> the strategies and recommendations that come out of it as a high
>>>> priority
>>>>> 5. A sense of urgency, and a proactive pursuit of achieving these goals
>>>>> with a well defined timeline (i.e. "resources will be allocated by
>>>> November
>>>>> 2012" not "we're working on it").
>>>>> 
>>>>> In my opinion, all of these must be met 100%. Otherwise there is no point
>>>>> starting at all and better to let it go and leave the enterprise space to
>>>>> other players like HTML5 as 'Oracle' is suggesting. This is your call.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I believe JavaFX can be the best platform for client-side enterprise
>>>>> application development, capitalising-on, and adding-to Java's dominance
>>>> in
>>>>> server side enterprise development.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Do you?
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> *Proposal to form a working group for JavaFX in the enterprise*
>>>>> 
>>>>> Mission:
>>>>> 
>>>>> - to position JavaFX as *the* dominant client-side development platform
>>>>> for enterprise/business applications
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Members:
>>>>> 
>>>>> - a combination of paid Oracle JavaFX team members, and community
>>>>> participants. The Oracle members must have the ability to access senior
>>>>> JavaFX management and technical decision makers, and as such influence
>>>> the
>>>>> road map and direction of the JavaFX platform. Community members will
>>>> be
>>>>> those with a background and experience in the enterprise space and who
>>>> are
>>>>> committed to making JavaFX the platform of choice in this space.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Responsibilities:
>>>>> 
>>>>> - Continuously identify improvements to the JavaFX platform that are
>>>>> needed to ensure adoption by enterprise; drive the inclusion of these
>>>> into
>>>>> the JavaFX platform.
>>>>> 
>>>>> - Continuously identify and monitor trends and developments within the
>>>>> enterprise space and competitor platforms (e.g. HTML5, .NET, etc) and
>>>>> ensure the JavaFX roadmap provides confidence to enterprise of JavaFX's
>>>>> long term viability for their needs.
>>>>> 
>>>>> - Provide best practices, community/forum support, documentation,
>>>>> examples, tool add-ons, frameworks and other aids for integrating
>>>> JavaFX
>>>>> into popular enterprise technology stacks
>>>>> 
>>>>> - Provide advocacy, publicity and drive general engagement and outreach
>>>>> programs for the adoption of JavaFX in the enterprise.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Objectives:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Objectives will be determined by the working group once formed, however
>>>>> initial objectives will likely include the following:
>>>>> 
>>>>> - Review the current deployment/distribution options for JavaFX and
>>>>> determine ways to improve this to make it competitive with other
>>>> popular
>>>>> enterprise client platforms (e.g. HTML+JavaScript) for primary
>>>> enterprise
>>>>> OS' and platforms
>>>>> 
>>>>> - Identify the most popular enterprise build and development tools and
>>>>> determine a strategy for making JavaFX integrate into these
>>>>> 
>>>>> - Review popular trends and toolkits within competitive platforms and
>>>>> define the ideal frameworks and add-on tools needed by an enterprise
>>>> client
>>>>> (e.g. form validation). Use this list of high-level requirements to
>>>>> determine the low-level JavaFX enhancements needed (e.g. allow field
>>>>> markers so that a 3rd party validation framework could leverage these).
>>>>> 
>>>>> - Create a demonstration enterprise application (along the lines of
>>>>> PetClinic) demonstrating best practice for integrating JavaFX in a
>>>> full,
>>>>> end-to-end JEE stack.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Longer term objectives may include:
>>>>> 
>>>>> - Develop (or foster community development of) the high-level
>>>> frameworks
>>>>> that have been identified as necessary for JavaFX in the enterprise.
>>>> These
>>>>> will likely be developed as third-party modules external to the JavaFX
>>>> core
>>>>> framework (i.e. built on top of the features provided by the core
>>>> JavaFX
>>>>> team).
>>>>> 
>>>>> - Provide integration with existing or new Rapid Application
>>>> Development
>>>>> (RAD) tools popular within the enterprise Java space (e.g. ROO, etc).
>>>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> 
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