Packaging Application Metadata

[Mark Fortner]

My earlier point was that if we can leverage the JRE as a configurable app
store client, then we should be able to deploy anywhere we have a JRE.
Think of it as webstart 2.0.

This could conceivable be some low hanging fruit that could be targeted
before tackling platform specific packaging.

Mark
On Apr 11, 2013 8:48 AM, "Danno Ferrin" <danno.ferrin at shemnon.com> wrote:

> The gradle plugin targets Windows, Mac, and Linux, but only generated the
> platform bundles for the platform you are building on.  The tool the JDK
> uses only builds MSIs on Windows, for example.
>
> On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 9:46 AM, Mark Fortner <phidias51 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Are MSIs buildable on Linux boxes?  I know there's a maven plugin to
>> build RPMs and debs and dmgs. And I know that Zonskis maven plugin made
>> most of that a lot easier to do. Danno, what platforms were you targeting
>> with your gradle plugin?
>>
>> Mark
>> On Apr 11, 2013 8:35 AM, "Danno Ferrin" <danno.ferrin at shemnon.com> wrote:
>>
>>> A properly configured MSI fits the automatic and invisible standard. I
>>> don't know if we have the hooks in the current deployment code to properly
>>> configure it (there is some GUID magic I am not familiar enough with).  But
>>> to get truly automatic and invisible I would expec that we would have to
>>> play by the platform's rules.  (DEBs and RPMs also if put in a proper repo
>>> are fairly quiet and automatic).
>>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 9:30 AM, Mark Fortner <phidias51 at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>> Deployment in the enterprise tends to be a little different than
>>>> deployment to a consumer. You have a more controlled environment, and the
>>>> less you have to deploy the better. You don't want to push a new JRE each
>>>> time and you don't want to constantly push dependencies. You can usually
>>>> find a target box to test on, but you don't want to have to configure and
>>>> install a series of VMs to build on all those platforms.
>>>>
>>>> Also you tend to do a rapid update cycle. New deployments every couple
>>>> of weeks. You don't want your users having to run installers that
>>>> frequently. Updates should be as automated and as invisible as possible.
>>>>
>>>> Mark
>>>> On Apr 11, 2013 8:13 AM, "Danno Ferrin" <danno.ferrin at shemnon.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hare to be a WORA basher, but you shouldn't be building and deploying
>>>>> packages on platforms you don't have one to test on.  So I don't see the
>>>>> requirement of packaging on the platform you are testing on to be an
>>>>> impediment.  As it stands, you must build iOS apps on a Mac and there are
>>>>> some deeply embedded code signing reasons why that won't ever be (legally)
>>>>> overcome.  Mac apps a little less so, unless you want to put it on the Mac
>>>>> App Store.  (Same with Win 8, Ubuntu and RasPi seem to be the outliers,
>>>>> although making a deb on a non Unix platform is a trip).   The vendor lock
>>>>> in is not in the packaging but the store.
>>>>>
>>>>> Coloring my view is the fact that I have also become a huge advocate
>>>>> of bring your own runtime, because the update releases are not all bug
>>>>> compatible.  And to bring your own runtime cross-compilation is often more
>>>>> difficult than firing up the build script on three different (virtual)
>>>>> machines.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 8:40 AM, Mark Fortner <phidias51 at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Creating installers is not really the issue. Izpack will let you do
>>>>>> that as
>>>>>> part of a maven build. The real issue is creating an artifact that is
>>>>>> runnable regardless of the platform. Either a native artifact, or a
>>>>>> universal artifact. If it's a native artifact we need to be able to
>>>>>> build
>>>>>> it even though we don't have the target platform installed. Something
>>>>>> which
>>>>>> currently seems to be beyond our reach.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Mark
>>>>>> On Apr 11, 2013 4:51 AM, "Pedro Duque Vieira" <
>>>>>> pedro.duquevieira at gmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> > Yeah.. I forgot to mention. I can generate all this installers (Mac
>>>>>> OS,
>>>>>> > Windows and Linux) from my windows machine.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Cheers,
>>>>>> >  On Apr 11, 2013 6:07 AM, "Mark Howe" <mark.howe at oracle.com> wrote:
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > > Thanks for the info, just curious does it matter which platform
>>>>>> you are
>>>>>> > > on, i.e. can you do all 3 from any of the 3 platforms?
>>>>>> > >
>>>>>> > > On Apr 10, 2013, at 2:30 PM, Pedro Duque Vieira wrote:
>>>>>> > >
>>>>>> > > > Hi Daniel,
>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>> > > > It generates dmg for Mac OS, ".sh" for unix and exe installers
>>>>>> for
>>>>>> > > windows.
>>>>>> > > > In this tool you can generate Mac OS and windows installers
>>>>>> that are
>>>>>> > self
>>>>>> > > > contained regarding the jre, i.e. no explicit installation of
>>>>>> java is
>>>>>> > > > required by the user, it is packaged with the installation file
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> > > > installed automatically. Only the Linux installers are
>>>>>> incapable of
>>>>>> > being
>>>>>> > > > self contained.
>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>> > > > I don't know how they do it, all I can say is that it works.
>>>>>> > > > They've been kind enough to offer me a free license for my free
>>>>>> > software.
>>>>>> > > > It's available for download in the download section of the site:
>>>>>> > > > http://modellus.co/ if you want to check them out.
>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>> > > > The mac version seems to be a little buggy (have to see if I
>>>>>> can get
>>>>>> > more
>>>>>> > > > time to fix it) but I guess that is related to problems with
>>>>>> the Mac OS
>>>>>> > > JRE
>>>>>> > > > rather than with the install4j tool.
>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>> > > > Cheers,
>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>> > > > On Wed, Apr 10, 2013 at 1:18 AM, Daniel Zwolenski <
>>>>>> zonski at gmail.com>
>>>>>> > > wrote:
>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>> > > >> How do they legally manage to do this and if they are doing
>>>>>> it, why
>>>>>> > > won't
>>>>>> > > >> Oracle?
>>>>>> > > >>
>>>>>> > > >>
>>>>>> > > >>
>>>>>> > >
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> http://resources.ej-technologies.com/install4j/help/doc/indexRedirect.html?http&&&resources.ej-technologies.com/install4j/help/doc/jreDownload.html
>>>>>> > > >>
>>>>>> > > >> (this note is suspicious: Note: JRE bundles are not supported
>>>>>> on Mac
>>>>>> > OS
>>>>>> > > X
>>>>>> > > >> for both technical and legal reasons.)
>>>>>> > > >>
>>>>>> > > >>
>>>>>> > > >>
>>>>>> > > >>
>>>>>> > > >> On Tue, Apr 9, 2013 at 8:09 PM, Daniel Zwolenski <
>>>>>> zonski at gmail.com>
>>>>>> > > wrote:
>>>>>> > > >>
>>>>>> > > >>> Using install4j you are able to produce all the deployment
>>>>>> bundles
>>>>>> > > (msi,
>>>>>> > > >>> rpgs, etc) for all the various platforms (windows, mac, etc)
>>>>>> on one
>>>>>> > > >>> development platform (e.g. on windows or on mac)?
>>>>>> > > >>>
>>>>>> > > >>> If so I'd be keen to look at what they are doing and how they
>>>>>> are
>>>>>> > doing
>>>>>> > > >>> it.
>>>>>> > > >>>
>>>>>> > > >>>
>>>>>> > > >>>
>>>>>> > > >>> On Tue, Apr 9, 2013 at 5:23 PM, Pedro Duque Vieira <
>>>>>> > > >>> pedro.duquevieira at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> > > >>>
>>>>>> > > >>>> I use install4j to great effect for deploying to Linux, Mac
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> > > Windows.
>>>>>> > > >>>>
>>>>>> > > >>>> I find it is a nice tool to use with a GUI to select through
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> > > several
>>>>>> > > >>>> options you want like icons, jar dependencies, jre, download
>>>>>> jre on
>>>>>> > > >>>> demand
>>>>>> > > >>>> or having the jre inside the instalation file, splash
>>>>>> screen, etc..
>>>>>> > > >>>>
>>>>>> > > >>>> The only issue is that it is a proprietary payed tool,
>>>>>> perhaps
>>>>>> > Oracle
>>>>>> > > >>>> could
>>>>>> > > >>>> create something like this.
>>>>>> > > >>>>
>>>>>> > > >>>> My 2 cents, cheers,
>>>>>> > > >>>>
>>>>>> > > >>>>
>>>>>> > > >>>>
>>>>>> > > >>>> --
>>>>>> > > >>>> Pedro Duque Vieira
>>>>>> > > >>>>
>>>>>> > > >>>
>>>>>> > > >>>
>>>>>> > > >>
>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>> > > >
>>>>>> > > > --
>>>>>> > > > Pedro Duque Vieira
>>>>>> > >
>>>>>> > >
>>>>>> >
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> There is nothing that will hold me back.  I know who I am....
>>>>> I remember wher I came from, and I feel stronger for knowing.
>>>>> Zane, Ninja of Ice.  Ninjago S01E07
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> There is nothing that will hold me back.  I know who I am....
>>> I remember wher I came from, and I feel stronger for knowing.
>>> Zane, Ninja of Ice.  Ninjago S01E07
>>>
>>
>
>
> --
> There is nothing that will hold me back.  I know who I am....
> I remember wher I came from, and I feel stronger for knowing.
> Zane, Ninja of Ice.  Ninjago S01E07
>