<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body style="overflow-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;">What platforms do you use “forceUploadingPainter” on?<div><div><br></div><div>I would like to prototype backdrop effects for all stage styles but, yeah, it’s complicated. The Windows 11 enumeration is short and based on the type of window (main, transient, tabbed) but the macOS enumeration is based on content (menu, tooltip, document, sidebar, etc.) and provides about 14 variants. Not sure how to reconcile those differences.</div><div><br></div><div><div><blockquote type="cite"><div>On Nov 13, 2025, at 9:22 AM, Christopher Schnick <crschnick@xpipe.io> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
<div><p>I think I stumbled upon this UNIFIED issue a while ago but the
workaround by setting -Dprism.forceUploadingPainter=true fixes it.
And these applications have been tested by many users no one ever
mentioned issues, so I'm reasonably sure that everything works
fine here.</p><p>On macOS, it adds a NSGlassEffectView subview behind the default
JavaFX NSView, yes. Any transparency is handled correctly with
this approach when the stage style is UNIFIED. It would be great
if EXTENDED could support this as well.</p><p>In general, it would be desirable for EXTENDED to have all the
properties of UNIFIED, otherwise I don't see much use for it.</p><p>Furthermore, an API to apply these window background themes
without any custom native calls would be cool as well, but here
the challenge is whether it would be accepted to have a
platform-specific list of available materials/themes in the API,
plus a few customization options. Because I don't see the
possibility of a generic API that works well on all platforms as
they all work so differently.</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 13/11/2025 18:09, Martin Fox wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite="mid:F2790D22-B845-47A0-AA62-49020191AD85@sbcglobal.net">
<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
Christopher,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>It will only work with UNIFIED. With the exception of UNIFIED
and TRANSPARENT the core Java code will draw an opaque
background fill behind the scene.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>On macOS the glass platform code will remove the layer’s
alpha channel unless the stage style is UNIFIED. I think that’s
a workaround for a bug that has long since been fixed (don’t
have the bug number handy). That logic wasn’t carried over to
the Metal branch and I would like to remove it for OpenGL as
well.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>UNIFIED doesn’t work reliably on Windows since the rendering
pipeline isn’t guaranteed to add an alpha channel (see <a href="https://bugs.openjdk.org/browse/JDK-8154847" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://bugs.openjdk.org/browse/JDK-8154847</a>).
Are you doing something to kick the HWND so you always get an
alpha channel?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>On macOS you must be adding a visual effect view to what is
known as the host view. It’s vestigial these days but I always
figured it would come in handy as a container for a visual
effect view. Looks like you’ve discovered that also.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Martin</div>
<div>
<div><br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>On Nov 13, 2025, at 8:22 AM, Christopher Schnick
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:crschnick@xpipe.io"><crschnick@xpipe.io></a> wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<div>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
<div><p>Haha yeah I thought the MonkeyTester would make a
good demo content page for a sample application. And
it does!</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 13/11/2025 17:20, Andy
Goryachev wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite="mid:CY8PR10MB72652ABB76B8096E353E12D7E5CDA@CY8PR10MB7265.namprd10.prod.outlook.com">
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
<div dir="ltr" style="font-family: "Iosevka Fixed SS16", Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;">
What Kickstart FX? :-)</div>
<div dir="ltr" style="font-family: "Iosevka Fixed SS16", Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;">
<br>
</div>
<div dir="ltr" style="font-family: "Iosevka Fixed SS16", Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;">
Joking, joking, I am glad you found it helping.</div>
<div dir="ltr" style="font-family: "Iosevka Fixed SS16", Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;">
<br>
</div>
<div dir="ltr" style="font-family: "Iosevka Fixed SS16", Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;">
-andy</div>
<div dir="ltr" style="font-family: "Iosevka Fixed SS16", Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;">
<br>
</div>
<div id="mail-editor-reference-message-container">
<div class="ms-outlook-mobile-reference-message skipProofing" style="text-align: left; padding: 3pt 0in 0in; border-width: 1pt medium medium; border-style: solid none none; border-color: rgb(181, 196, 223) currentcolor currentcolor; font-family: Aptos; font-size: 12pt;">
<b><br><p style="font-family: Calibri; font-size: 10pt; margin: 5pt; font-style: normal; font-weight: normal; text-decoration: none;" align="Left"> Confidential- Oracle Internal<br>
</p>
From: </b>openjfx-dev <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:openjfx-dev-retn@openjdk.org" moz-do-not-send="true"><openjfx-dev-retn@openjdk.org></a>
on behalf of Christopher Schnick <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:crschnick@xpipe.io" moz-do-not-send="true"><crschnick@xpipe.io></a><br>
<b>Date: </b>Thursday, November 13, 2025 at 06:27<br>
<b>To: </b>Michael Strauß <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:michaelstrau2@gmail.com" moz-do-not-send="true"><michaelstrau2@gmail.com></a><br>
<b>Cc: </b>OpenJFX <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:openjfx-dev@openjdk.org" moz-do-not-send="true"><openjfx-dev@openjdk.org></a><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: StageStyle.EXTENDED with
transparent background<br>
<br>
</div><p class="ms-outlook-mobile-reference-message skipProofing">We run our
applications with native materials for some time
now without any issues.<br>
<br>
On Windows 11, it uses the Mica material for the
Stage. It automatically adjusts based on the
system theme, so you will always have a good look
and contrast for all theme configurations. The
mica material can also be swtiched to the acrylic
one, however the acrylic theme was primarily
intended for Windows 10 and is being replaced by
Mica for Windows 11.<br>
<br>
On macOS, it uses the new Liquid Glass material in
macOS 26 and the Vibrant material for older
versions. With Liquid Glass you can also configure
the tint if needed.<br>
<br>
This can all be achieved via a few native calls
with the existing Stages, at least with the older
stage styles like Unified.<br>
<br>
Isn't the original issue just about the extended
stage style using a white background? I'm no
expert on the implementation, but the other types
of Stages like Unified show their background if
you set the Scene and root node background to be
transparent. Normally that window fill was always
white anyway as JavaFX did not support window
theming before, but if the window theme is set to
something different, then that sticks out. Is
there something fundamentally limiting so that the
Extended stage is forced to draw a white
background?</p><p class="ms-outlook-mobile-reference-message skipProofing">Unified:</p><p class="ms-outlook-mobile-reference-message skipProofing"><span id="cid:part1.V2pnV2yW.GGadQUhf@xpipe.io"><aBRzaHD5w0KvUgrJ.png></span></p><p class="ms-outlook-mobile-reference-message skipProofing">Extended, even
with DWMWA_USE_IMMERSIVE_DARK_MODE set to true:</p><p class="ms-outlook-mobile-reference-message skipProofing"><span id="cid:part2.v40penPG.sX7vbjaY@xpipe.io"><HRrOi0IB1NCsFlHW.png></span></p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 13/11/2025 00:33,
Michael Strauß wrote:</div>
<blockquote>
<blockquote>
<pre><div class="moz-quote-pre">I finally got around to looking into this. I see two requests here, one to add per-pixel window transparency to EXTENDED stages and another to support backdrop materials like Windows’ Mica and Acrylic.
On the Mac adding per-pixel transparency to all stage styles is easy. On Windows it would take a lot more work and as far as I know can’t be done with the existing DX9 back end (the necessary DirectComposition API’s are tied to DX11). We would also need to reconcile platform differences related to hit testing and drop shadows. So it’s a big ask.
</div></pre>
</blockquote>
<pre><div class="moz-quote-pre">I think we can probably get there by using a WS_EX_LAYERED window like
we do for StageStyle.TRANSPARENT, if we accept the significant
performance impact. With DirectComposition, we can directly interface
with the DWM composition engine and skip the GDI window surface
completely. This requires a fair bit of integration with JavaFX that
goes beyond changes in the Glass toolkit. However, it doesn't require
a D3D11 rendering pipeline. It works with the existing D3D9 pipeline
by having D3D9 render into a shared off-screen surface, which is then
accessed by DirectComposition with ID3D11Device::OpenSharedResource.
</div></pre>
<blockquote>
<pre><div class="moz-quote-pre">(I know there’s a DX12 version of JavaFX in the works but it’s hard for me to get enthused. I run Windows in a VM and it’s likely to be stuck on DX11 for a long time.)
Supporting translucent backdrop materials is simpler since we can ask the OS to draw the effect and then composite the JavaFX content over it all within an opaque window. This is how the UNIFIED stage style works so we can leverage that logic. On Mac this is easy to set up. On Windows 11 22H2 and beyond we can easily access a couple of materials. For earlier Windows versions or for a more extensive list of materials we would need to roll our own using DirectComposition.
</div></pre>
</blockquote>
<pre><div class="moz-quote-pre">That's correct, it's reasonably simple to support platform-provided
backdrop materials. Anything custom is a lot more difficult.
I have a prototype of JavaFX with DirectComposition, along with a
custom acrylic implementation. It's very old, and looks like this
(running on Windows 10):
<a href="https://github.com/user-attachments/assets/cd702a74-603a-4d7e-9078-52f915a4448a" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" data-outlook-id="6cc370eb-9f46-43b9-b1a6-e18939fe0db1" moz-do-not-send="true">https://github.com/user-attachments/assets/cd702a74-603a-4d7e-9078-52f915a4448a</a>
In the end, there doesn't seem to be much common ground between the
various OS platforms for any reasonably powerful cross-platform API.
Maybe we could have the supporting infrastructure in JavaFX, but only
exposing API in a platform-specific module (either as part of OpenJFX
or 3rd party)? This certainly requires quite a bit of work.
</div></pre>
<blockquote>
<pre><div class="moz-quote-pre">I know nothing about DirectComposition but I’m pretty sure someone on this list has used it to prototype an Acrylic effect for JavaFX. I’ll see if I can find that e-mail. I’m particularly interested in whether this can easily be turned on and off on-the-fly and how dark mode would be handled (the platform-provided materials respond to dark mode).
</div></pre>
</blockquote>
<pre><div class="moz-quote-pre">I've never heard of any previous effort, and it couldn't have been me
beacuse I haven't talked about this up util now. I'd be interested to
learn about other attempts at solving this.
</div></pre>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div></blockquote></div><br></div></div></body></html>