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    <p>The behavior is undefined. It might crash, or not.</p>
    <p>While the description says that the downcall should not upcall,
      please note that the Javadoc doesn't say anywhere that ill-behaved
      downcalls will produce new errors. Moreover, the javadoc says
      this:</p>
    <p>
      <blockquote type="cite">
        <p> Using this linker option when linking non trivial functions
          is likely to have adverse effects, such as loss of
          performance, or JVM crashes.</p>
      </blockquote>
      Basically, you are in undefined behavior territory. It seems to me
      that you are inferring too much from the javadoc.</p>
    <p>While I agree it might be desirable to detect this and log some
      kind of error (see email I sent yesterday), I don't think that, as
      thing stands, the javadoc is incorrect, and/or lacking
      information.</p>
    <p>Maurizio<br>
    </p>
    <p><br>
    </p>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 27/07/2023 14:40, Cheng Jin wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite" cite="mid:BN8PR15MB257733FE3CA75202C523ADD7F501A@BN8PR15MB2577.namprd15.prod.outlook.com">
      
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        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">But I tried
            a simple example to indirectly trigger a JNI upcall within a
            trivial FFM downcall by saving a global JNIEnv within a JNI
            downcall at first which works good as follows. Does it mean
            that a FFM trivial downcall literally doesn’t stop a JNI
            upcall which seems inconsistent with the description of
            <a href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://download.java.net/java/early_access/jdk21/docs/api/java.base/java/lang/foreign/Linker.Option.html*isTrivial()__;Iw!!ACWV5N9M2RV99hQ!KpMq9yrQInVdYsiAcZWCDTeOZd_GLJwrDN4n06JvbKQ194M_eabqlUaxzgDuSjbnoxQLukS4Uu8wT7q__xolFW5e$" moz-do-not-send="true">
https://download.java.net/java/early_access/jdk21/docs/api/java.base/java/lang/foreign/Linker.Option.html#isTrivial()</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">or OpenJDK
            doesn’t support such behavior mixed with JNI & FFM?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt">[1]
              JniTest.java<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">public class
            JniTest {<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">       
            private static Linker linker = Linker.nativeLinker();<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">   static {<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">     
            System.loadLibrary("jnitest");<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">   }<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">       
            private static final SymbolLookup nativeLibLookup =
            SymbolLookup.loaderLookup();<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">private
            native int addJNI2Ints(int arg1, int arg2);<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">    public
            int <b>addJNI2Ints_Upcall</b>(int arg1, int arg2) {<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">      int
            sum = arg1 + arg2;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">     
            System.out.println("trivial: addJNI2Ints_Upcall: sum = " +
            sum);<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">      return
            sum;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">    }<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">       
            public void test_add2Ints() throws Throwable {<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">               
            FunctionDescriptor fd = FunctionDescriptor.of(JAVA_INT,
            JAVA_INT, JAVA_INT);<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">               
            MemorySegment functionSymbol =
            nativeLibLookup.find("add2Ints").get();<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">               
            MethodHandle mh = linker.downcallHandle(functionSymbol, fd,
            <b>Linker.Option.isTrivial()</b>);<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">               
            int result = (int)mh.invokeExact(112, 123);<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">               
            System.out.println("test_add2Ints result = " + result);<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">        }<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">   public
            static void main(String[] args) throws Throwable {<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">     
            JniTest test = new JniTest();<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">      int
            sum = test.<b>addJNI2Ints</b>(112, 123);
          </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Wingdings">ß</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt">-- call the JNI native at first to
            save the global JNIEnv & jobject<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">     
            System.out.println("addJNI2Ints sum = " + sum);<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">     
            test.test_<b>add2Ints</b>();
          </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Wingdings">ß</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt">-- use saved the global JNIEnv
            & jobject to trigger a JNI upcall in native.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">   }<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">}<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt">[2]
              JniTest.c<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">#include
            <jni.h><o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">#include
            "JniTest.h"<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">JNIEnv
            *globalEnv;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">jobject
            globalObj;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">JNIEXPORT
            int JNICALL Java_JniTest_addJNI2Ints(JNIEnv *env, jobject
            thisObj, jint arg1, jint arg2) {<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">    jint
            intSum = arg1 + arg2;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">   
            globalEnv = env;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">   
            globalObj = thisObj;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">   
            printf("\nJava_JniTest_addJNI2Ints: env = %p, globalObj =
            %p\n", globalEnv, globalObj);<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">    return
            intSum;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">}<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">int<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">add2Ints(int
            intArg1, int intArg2)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">{<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">       
            printf("\nadd2Ints: globalEnv = %p, globalObj = %p\n",
            globalEnv, globalObj);<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">    jclass
            clazz = (*globalEnv)->GetObjectClass(globalEnv,
            globalObj);<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">   
            jmethodID method = (*globalEnv)->GetMethodID(globalEnv,
            clazz, "addJNI2Ints_Upcall", "(II)I");<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">    return
            (*globalEnv)->CallIntMethod(globalEnv, globalObj, method,
            intArg1, intArg2);<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">}<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">[3]Commands:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">./jdk21_hotspot_x86_64/bin/javac 
            --enable-preview --source 21  -h . JniTest.java<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">gcc -fPIC
            -I"./jdk21_hotspot_x86_64/include"
            -I"./jdk21_hotspot_x86_64/include/linux" -shared -g  -o
            libjnitest.so  JniTest.c<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">./jdk21_hotspot_x86_64/bin/java
            --enable-preview  -Djava.library.path=./jnitests 
            --enable-native-access=ALL-UNNAMED
            -Dforeign.restricted=permit   JniTest<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">[4] Output:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Java_JniTest_addJNI2Ints:
            env = 0x7f81f8028a08, globalObj = 0x7f81ff379998<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">addJNI2Ints
            sum = 235<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">add2Ints:
            intSum = 235<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">add2Ints:
            globalEnv = 0x7f81f8028a08, globalObj = 0x7f81ff379998<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt">trivial:
              addJNI2Ints_Upcall: sum = 235
            </span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Wingdings">ß</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">test_add2Ints
            result = 235<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Best Regards<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Cheng Jin<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
          1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
          <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US"> Maurizio Cimadamore
              <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:maurizio.cimadamore@oracle.com"><maurizio.cimadamore@oracle.com></a>
              <br>
              <b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, July 26, 2023 8:45 PM<br>
              <b>To:</b> Cheng Jin <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:jincheng@ca.ibm.com"><jincheng@ca.ibm.com></a>;
              <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:panama-dev@openjdk.org">panama-dev@openjdk.org</a><br>
              <b>Subject:</b> [EXTERNAL] Re: Questions about the trivial
              downcall<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        </div>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-line-height-alt:.75pt"><span style="font-size:1.0pt;color:white">On 27/07/2023 01: 40,
              Cheng Jin wrote: >> Right, JNI has not much to do
              with this. There's different ways to upcall back into Java
              (JNI and FFM upcall stubs). If so, my understanding is
              that both JNI and FFM upcall should crash the VM <o:p></o:p></span></p>
        </div>
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-line-height-alt:.75pt"><span style="font-size:1.0pt;color:white">ZjQcmQRYFpfptBannerStart<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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                  #90A4AE 3.0pt" width="100%" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" border="1">
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                        4.5pt" valign="top">
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                                <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">This
                                      Message Is From an External Sender
                                      <o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
                              </td>
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                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">This
                                    message came from outside your
                                    organization.
                                    <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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          <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-line-height-alt:.75pt"><span style="font-size:1.0pt;color:white">ZjQcmQRYFpfptBannerEnd<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        </div>
        <p><o:p> </o:p></p>
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">On
              27/07/2023 01:40, Cheng Jin wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        </div>
        <blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
          <p>>> Right, JNI has not much to do with this. There's
            different ways to upcall back into Java (JNI and FFM upcall
            stubs).<o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">If so, my
              understanding is that both JNI and FFM upcall should crash
              the VM in a trivial FFM downcall, correct?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
        </blockquote>
        <p>I believe so. Jorn will confirm.<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p>Maurizio<o:p></o:p></p>
        <blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Best
              Regards</span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Cheng Jin</span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
            1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
            <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US"> Maurizio
                Cimadamore
              </span><a href="mailto:maurizio.cimadamore@oracle.com" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US"><maurizio.cimadamore@oracle.com></span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US">
                <br>
                <b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, July 26, 2023 8:29 PM<br>
                <b>To:</b> Cheng Jin </span><a href="mailto:jincheng@ca.ibm.com" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US"><jincheng@ca.ibm.com></span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US">;
              </span><a href="mailto:panama-dev@openjdk.org" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US">panama-dev@openjdk.org</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US"><br>
                <b>Subject:</b> [EXTERNAL] Re: Questions about the
                trivial downcall</span><o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-line-height-alt:.75pt"><span style="font-size:1.0pt;color:white">and does not call
                back into Java (e. g. using an upcall stub).
                ß------------------------- it occurs to me that any kind
                of upcall should be disallowed in such case whether it
                is JNI or FFM, am I correct? Right, JNI has not much to
                do with this. 
              </span><o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-line-height-alt:.75pt"><span style="font-size:1.0pt;color:white">ZjQcmQRYFpfptBannerStart</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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                                  <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">This
                                        Message Is From an External
                                        Sender
                                      </span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
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                              </tr>
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                                <td style="padding:3.0pt 6.0pt 3.0pt
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                                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">This
                                      message came from outside your
                                      organization.
                                    </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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                                  <p class="MsoNormal">  <a href="https://us-phishalarm-ewt.proofpoint.com/EWT/v1/PjiDSg!2c-gyJS_6lP6sKYb2IHEjb2TaeBqM7xJQ9RStijLaImfla_LrFEK8T2PB5_umxDwUuL8X7BGAHosOeXRLCglJfzdYnJaiHF6gQ$" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><strong><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black;border:solid
                                          #666666
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          </div>
          <blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
            <div>
              <p>and does not call back into Java (e.g. using an upcall
                stub). <span style="font-family:Wingdings">
                  ß</span>------------------------- it occurs to me that
                any kind of upcall should be disallowed in such case
                whether it is JNI or FFM, am I correct?
                <o:p></o:p></p>
            </div>
          </blockquote>
          <p>Right, JNI has not much to do with this. There's different
            ways to upcall back into Java (JNI and FFM upcall stubs).<o:p></o:p></p>
          <p>Your question is: what happens if we do call back when we
            are in trivial mode.<o:p></o:p></p>
          <p>I believe the answer is "we crash" (but not in a "nice
            way"), and I'm not too sure we can do much to prevent that.
            I believe Jorn knows more on that topic.<o:p></o:p></p>
          <p>Maurizio<o:p></o:p></p>
          <blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Best Regards</span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Cheng Jin</span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
                1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
                <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US"> Maurizio
                    Cimadamore
                  </span><a href="mailto:maurizio.cimadamore@oracle.com" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US"><maurizio.cimadamore@oracle.com></span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US">
                    <br>
                    <b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, July 26, 2023 7:44 PM<br>
                    <b>To:</b> Cheng Jin </span><a href="mailto:jincheng@ca.ibm.com" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US"><jincheng@ca.ibm.com></span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US">;
                  </span><a href="mailto:panama-dev@openjdk.org" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US">panama-dev@openjdk.org</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-US"><br>
                    <b>Subject:</b> [EXTERNAL] Re: Questions about the
                    trivial downcall</span><o:p></o:p></p>
              </div>
              <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-line-height-alt:.75pt"><span style="font-size:1.0pt;color:white">Hi, a trivial
                    downcall is supposed to target a native function
                    that (a) terminates quickly (so as not to block the
                    GC for too long) and (b) does not upcall into Java.
                    So, no, a trivial downcall cannot trigger upcalls (I
                    don't think we detect </span><o:p></o:p></p>
              </div>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-line-height-alt:.75pt"><span style="font-size:1.0pt;color:white">ZjQcmQRYFpfptBannerStart</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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                                      <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">This
                                            Message Is From an External
                                            Sender
                                          </span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
                                    </td>
                                  </tr>
                                  <tr>
                                    <td style="padding:3.0pt 6.0pt 3.0pt
                                      6.0pt">
                                      <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">This
                                          message came from outside your
                                          organization.
                                        </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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                                      <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">  </span><a href="https://us-phishalarm-ewt.proofpoint.com/EWT/v1/PjiDSg!2c-r455VanMQ2qYReaGl7Z4QRx46ATMxAjK9nbXsj13QlLeimn0PtcIAb-U80cJ-A34Q8dYfoQ6JN5nMYOpBz-Hn3cuAGTZLJQ$" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><strong><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black;border:solid
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                <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-line-height-alt:.75pt"><span style="font-size:1.0pt;color:white">ZjQcmQRYFpfptBannerEnd</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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              <p>Hi,<br>
                a trivial downcall is supposed to target a native
                function that (a) terminates quickly (so as not to block
                the GC for too long) and (b) does not upcall into Java.<o:p></o:p></p>
              <p>So, no, a trivial downcall cannot trigger upcalls (I
                don't think we detect this, I believe the JVM just
                crashes if you do).<o:p></o:p></p>
              <p>Also I notice that you speak of "JNI" upcall. Is that
                what you really mean - e.g. a trivial FFM downcall
                making an upcall using JNI? In general, I think it's a
                bit hard for downcalls to do anything that has to do
                with JNI because the invoked native function is not
                passed a JNIEnv - FFM really just bridges the Java code
                with the native library function you want to call,
                nothing more. (I suppose that function could get its
                hands on the VM using the JNI attach API, but I feel
                that's a different question from what you were asking?).<o:p></o:p></p>
              <p>Maurizio<o:p></o:p></p>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">On 26/07/2023 22:23, Cheng
                    Jin wrote:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
              </div>
              <blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
                <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Hi there,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">I’ve got a couple of
                    questions about the behavior of a trivial downcall
                    (with
                    <b>isTrivial</b> specified).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Is a FFI downcall able to
                    trigger a JNI upcall ?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">If so, should a JNI upcall
                    should be captured in this trivial downcall?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Best Regards</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Cheng Jin</span><o:p></o:p></p>
              </blockquote>
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