[External] : Re: Be wary: --enable-native-access is breaking integrity

[Glavo]

>
> I think we should tone down the level of uproar about a flag. Flags is how
> Java is configured. We offer jlink and @files as means of storing and
> sharing such command line configurations.
>
> I mean, I’m certain there are people out there who find typing the
> character ‘{‘ difficult, but these people aren’t using Java. A Java
> programmer probably sets the command line several times a week. If setting
> the command line is “pain” that’s sufficient to force people to leave Java,
> then those people would have left a long time ago. So yes, there’s a very
> minor inconvenience involved, and we can spend more time explaining why
> it’s needed, but let’s not turn this into a high stakes thing. Also,
> between asking people to add flags we also deliver things like FFM and
> virtual threads and records, so let’s not try to present this like it’s
> some end of the world. Among all the things we’re delivering we’re also
> imposing some minor inconvenience from time to time when we think it’s
> absolutely necessary. You don’t have to agree that it’s necessary, but I
> think it’s pretty clear that it’s not that big of a pain.
>

So why do we need JEP 330 and JEP 445?

Yes, we have some mature complex programs that require a lot of
configuration, but that's not all.
We also have small programs that work out of the box, and complex programs
also have a process from simple to complex.

Sometimes adding command-line arguments is not a concern, but not all the
time.
Java is moving along the lines of simplifying other situations, so please
don't go backwards.

Glavo

On Wed, Aug 30, 2023 at 12:41 AM Ron Pressler <ron.pressler at oracle.com>
wrote:

>
>
> > On 29 Aug 2023, at 16:19, Glavo <zjx001202 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > I agree with this approach, this kind of pain that cannot be borne by
> anyone alone is indeed a means of forcing users to leave.
> >
> > However, --enable-native-access is abusing negative feedback.
> > FFI is a legitimate requirement, and many applications cannot avoid
> using them.
> > You try to inflict inescapable pain on everyone, and the result may be
>
> I think we should tone down the level of uproar about a flag. Flags is how
> Java is configured. We offer jlink and @files as means of storing and
> sharing such command line configurations.
>
> I mean, I’m certain there are people out there who find typing the
> character ‘{‘ difficult, but these people aren’t using Java. A Java
> programmer probably sets the command line several times a week. If setting
> the command line is “pain” that’s sufficient to force people to leave Java,
> then those people would have left a long time ago. So yes, there’s a very
> minor inconvenience involved, and we can spend more time explaining why
> it’s needed, but let’s not turn this into a high stakes thing. Also,
> between asking people to add flags we also deliver things like FFM and
> virtual threads and records, so let’s not try to present this like it’s
> some end of the world. Among all the things we’re delivering we’re also
> imposing some minor inconvenience from time to time when we think it’s
> absolutely necessary. You don’t have to agree that it’s necessary, but I
> think it’s pretty clear that it’s not that big of a pain.
>
> — Ron
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